Most liked posts in thread: Brexit - 2nd Referendum - The (Bradford City FC) Peoples Vote

I am extremely concerned about the road our country is traveling at the moment. We ‘appear’ to be binning democracy. The political classes in Westminster have decided that the populace didn’t know what they were voting for, no sorry just the 52% didn’t know.

I am aghast that we are now told that a group of MP’s intend to take over the House of Commons so they can take control of Brexit. The liberal leader with a certain amount of glee said it is now the beginning of the end of Brexit all together.

Those that are now clamouring for a 2nd referendum are ignoring the fact that a sovereign promise was made to the British ppl that there would be only one vote on this issue and the government whatever way the vote went would deliver whatever the ppl decided. These same ppl when pressed that they are ignoring the original vote, say oh no they respect that vote, but now they will know what they are voting for, they say this without blinking an eyelid, oh and have now reclassed the 2nd referendum as a People’s Vote!

Nevertheless, I honestly do not know what it will achieve if we had an identical vote, wouldthis vote be more valid than the last one? If so, how? What will be the questions this time around? If it inconclusive what then. This will take approximately 9 months to complete, meanwhile we live in suspension and all the ramifications that would involve. No doubt a general election, lack of stability, the economy dragging itself along, further rifts within local communities and the nation as a whole.

The EU do not want us to leave, and by giving a deal/outlined deal and refusing to move on any of its red lines are now trying to sell us a pig in a poke.

The whole process was and is a shambles from start to finish, we were not confident in our own ability as a Nation, we stood differing while the EU took control.

I voted to remain, not because I love the EU far from it, but because I absolutely knew it would be like this and cause further division within the country. I believe government should be as close to the ppl it serves, and less government is more as far as I am concerned. It is extremely expensive, and doesn’t really respect sovereign nations.

If they call for a another referendum, then I will vote to leave in solidarity of those who voted in the first referendum. If the result is reversed, I will never vote again, because democracy will have died, and there would be no point. I have voted all my life, never missed a GE, or referendum, and the majority of local and EU votes.

Ok, rant over.

 

Does it really matter what party your on , when really it’s about national interest ? Surely the best option here now is to all sit down together and work out the best deal for the country . It shouldn’t be about sides. The country voted leave . That’s final .Now let’s work out as a country what is the best deal we can get and deal with it

 

I voted out and remain a leaver , the unelected EU are showing their true colours . I actually think the EU will implode in the next couple of years with a lot of countries pulling out , maybe this is why Macron and Merkel are promoting a EU army , to " influence " future referendums .

 

I revert to default setting , Nobody in the UK actually voted to join the EU , we voted to join the Common market . Since that day we have been lied to , politicians of all parties have surrendered our rights down the years into a unelected bottomless money pit , Heath , Major , Bliar and Clown have ( without ) a mandate to become a a member of a Federal super state . We have little or no say in our futures . I voted leave and will never change my mind . A Genie as been let out of the bottle , the political ruling elite don't like it but it is gathering momentum not only in the UK but across Europe and the World , the rise of the right and Nationionalism can be laid at the feet of Politicians that for years ignored the wishes of the people , well you reap what you sew .

 

Although supporting Brexit I was never of the view that parliament and our elected elite betters would allow the wishes of the people and that they would stop us leaving the EU, They have always demonstrated a view that they view the electorate as inferior to themselves and tonight have proved that conclusively

 

We were given a democratic vote, We were all sent a leaflet and advice asking us to stay and what leaving would be like for the economy with dire warnings of the result of a leave vote, This £9million bill was paid for by the government and no such funding was allowed for the leave side, Re -writing history because the result goes against you is common but wrong, The government after giving everyone lots of advice through the remain leaflet and tv debates and plenty of press and news shows gave the people a simple choice, Remain or leave, The democratic result was leave and should be respected and honoured in full

 

So gracious of the remainers to except anything , it was clearly stated in the government issued pamphlet what a leave vote would mean , i find it very ironic that the more intelligent and younger voters are the ones that didn't , i remember this conversation 2 years ago , the lies about there isn't a plan for a EU army ( why would a trading block need 1 anyway ?) .

Macron and Merkal want more powers transfering to Strasbourg or Brussels ( whoevers turn it is this week ). They want satilite states IE the UK etc to be mearly vassels in a European super state . The French are in disarray as the green vest protest s are Showing , Germany are on the brink of recession , how will these 2 countries pay the shortfall when we leave . Thats the crux of the matter though they arn't really bothered about the UK in general they just want our contributions to finance their failling experiment .

The protests have started already in this country , whether you like it or not they will get much much worse if the ruling Political elite across Europe do not listen to the electorate . How many referendums do you think it would take 3 , 4 ,6 ? till the EU get the result they will accept . I remember forecasting the rise of right wing politics 2 years ago it's been proven correct , this is all down to the idiots in Westminster and in Europe . Both the main parties in this country are finished ( or will be next election ) .

What is needed is a new party that listens to the people and acts on their behalf , there are too many career MPs who only care about their constituents at election time , well suck it up because this country will never ever be the same again .

 

The EU is dying, Financially in huge debt, Has not published its accounts in years because no accountant can see the books or balance them because money just disappears, It will tighten its grip on its member states ever gaining more power from them until it controls all areas of each state, The real question is why would we want to stay in a corrupt organisation that has little democracy and demands more and more money from the UK, We may be the first but doubt will be the last, We have the chance of getting in the lifeboat and becoming free to make our own more prosperous future, The unrest is growing in the EU

 

Sorry it wasn't aimed at you per se, more of a rant at hearing the same thing over and over again about old white people. Thing is people are wrongly assuming that somehow the 'old white male' vote was behind the dastardly vote to leave the EU and its the sinister undertones that the same people link this myth too to suit their own agenda. I voted to leave, my dad voted to leave. We are two 'old white males', well my Dad is and i'm not far behind these days. Yet we are then categorised and stereotyped without anyone actually knowing why we voted. You know the sort of thing, beer swilling, EDL supporting, working class spongers "It's all them bloody foreigners innit, taking our jobs and ruining our communities etc..."
As i mentioned i now couldn't care less what happened, i can't see into the future but i had a pretty good idea how this would turn out. And the politicians didn't disappoint.

I keep out of the Brexit debate now and i feel so much better for it.

 

I never claimed or said it was anti democratic or that it was a dictatorship, Those are words in your mind not that I have posted, You do realise democracy comes in many forms and the EU has a very loose version that many say including myself should be vastly improved to give more representation, However we have been trying to reform the EU for over 20 years with no or little success so in my humble opinion we should leave and have our destiny in our own hands instead of a failing EU demanding more and more from us

 

Here's an interesting book.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Blood-Streets-Investment-Profits-World/dp/067162735X

A book written by Rees Mogg father discussing how an economic crisis is ripe for investing and making money. Coincidentally Rees Mogg helps run an investment fund

 

BTW if there is a second referendum the question should be a choice between 1, The deal on offer, or 2, Leave with no deal. There should be no remain option as that has already been asked and a clear answer given, The referendum should be HOW we leave not IF again

 

It allowed leavers to vote leave and remainers to vote remain, It is not hard to understand unless you have lost and bitter
BTW did the remainers tell everyone our contributions would increase over the years or that the EU want a EU army taking defence decisions away from the UK, Did they mention the EU is determined that all countries within the EU will have to use the Euro and use the EU central bank instead of the bank of England, Did they mention the creep in EU powers that will take all decisions to the EU bureaucrats?
No thought not,
Most people realise that the EU does not stand still and has the ambition to be the United states of Europe where countries become vassal states run by a an elite group of bureaucrats in the name of but not by or of the people whom they regard as stupid, Those voting to remain proved there point

 

History tells us that the young are more idealistic and tend to be more socialist in their views and tend to support Labour,
However as they grow older and some say wiser their views change over time and tend to be more conservative, It is an ongoing process and a great many of the younger generation who might support remain today will change their view as they get older and vote to leave thus replacing those who pass away,
Those who want a peoples vote have never explained what happens if Leave win again which is a strong possibility, they arrogantly believe that the only outcome of a peoples vote will be to remain

 

True.

I just can't fathom this whole 'we can't allow a no deal' thing. If we don't agree to a deal then there's obviously no deal. That's the default position surely??

 

I'm not sure he had an option though. It will be the poorest in society that will feel the most pain from tariffs being applied to goods entering the country. Both as consumers and as workers in industries impacted. The country as a whole will survive no deal, but the impact on the poorest will be greatest. That's why he has to stand up to that outcome imo.

I could see a 'soft' Brexit getting through parliament but it will probably destroy the Tories and rip apart Labour's support base.

 

Point 4 bemuses me somewhat. Its getting to the point where being an old white male is some of offence, like their views don’t count anymore.
I personally couldn’t give a shiny shite what happens with Brexit but this constant berating of white males, and particularly older ones, in the media is becoming tiresome. Believe it or not most of the ‘white malea’ in this world just want to get on with their lives instead of being made out to be the incarnation of the devil.

 

This TV debate. I won’t be tuning in to that shite. Much like Question Time and PMQ’s, it’s just an exercise in preaching to the converted and/or getting the usual people angry. Totally pointless, especially as there’s no public vote at the end of it, like there would be at a normal TV debate.

 

Fair enough , but most of it is conjecture based on forecasts. I note the heavy use of modal verbs - could, would, should.

I don't doubt that there are significant opportunities for us with no deal, but there is also a potentially huge downside especially in the short-term. The upheaval and uncertainty if we just crash out is frightening. It is fine for multi-millionaires to be blasé about the impact, for millions of people who will take the brunt of the impact it is an appalling prospect.

Yet, I don't see how we avoid that prospect now other than not leaving in March next year.