Possibility of football stopping (again)

Can these people not decide whether to work/volunteer or not?

I don't see how it's relevant.

I imagine any one of those can work around it, including managers, who can manage from home.

 

On the Isle of Wight they do

 

The reason the City game is off is because someone has breached it.

We've one person in here that goes to games - WHY??

Football needs to help itself.

 

This highlights a SIGFINCANT problem that the UK government has failed time and time again to point out.

The reason why we ALL do this is because if the hospital are full what would you do if you had a broken arm? A stroke or a heart attack? You'd die. People fail to realise this is for everyones direct benefit.

Plus other cheaper more easily manufactured vaccines will become available soon so expect daily vaccinations to increase tenfold.

If we get through to march and no postponement of the football we will be alright.

And lastly lets stop being selfish. Its crap for everyone but lets not sacrifice our grandparents for freedom 3 months early.

 

Unfortunately, putting covid before everything else has meant others have died from not getting treatment for cancer etc.

Think many grandparents would rather just be able to have a choice what to do now.

Oh and how do you know these vaccines are 2-3 months away? Doesn't seem that why today does it?

 

Cool.

They don't need to stop football. If we do end up doing that, it's due to a crippling lack of imagination.

Frankly, a nation that can't think of a way of putting on a football match without endangering 200 people deserves all the chronic bankruptcy and financial ruin it would inevitably find itself in.

I appreciate the link and all, but how about we just adjust the document?

 

Paul Embery isn't wrong but we need to be careful with what he's saying.

The bar for what classifies as a 'pre-existing condition' is very low. I think it includes things like obesity, asthma and diabetes.

His statistic is more a reflection of the fact that quite a lot of people will fall under these categories rather than simply how "safe" it is.

 

Forgive me for being dumb but what do we do next year and the year after, ad infinitum. Every year we have a different strain of the Flu virus and need a different vaccine, the Covid virus has already mutated, what's to say the vaccines will still work on any new strains?
Do we just end life now?
It's not often but I do agree with Fordy to some extent on this, we should have been protecting the vulnerable instead of just locking everybody down.
I don't mean just locking them away but we could have put plans in place that prevented them having to go out including providing all their shopping needs etc. even if we had provided then for free it would have been cheaper than what we are paying for now, it would also have kept hundreds of thousands of people still in a job. It would have kept most small and medium businesses going, instead thousands are going bust including pubs and restaurants etc and for what?
They have had over a year to put extra measures in place in terms of hospitals and emergency care to treat people but instead what they have done is given a Covid payment to Hospitals and Doctors for every single patient that is diagnosed with the virus.
Anyway enough ranting now but needed to get that off my chest.

 

sorry, but as a patient facing NHS member of staff who continues to work with Covid patients I can 100% tell you that what you and Fordy think should happen is rubbish. this does not just kill the elderly and the frail or those who only have underlying conditions. of course these number of deaths are lower but the effects of Covid go far beyond just killing people.

you suggest just protecting the vulnerable. what do those NHS staff that are vulnerable do? how do trusts replace them? because there are a lot of them. me included. then there are those that work in social care, what about those people? teachers and other key workers who fall into your vulnerable category? actually, not just vulnerable key workers but vulnerable workers in general? it's not as simplistic as you seen to think.

and as for your 'payment' suggestion - let's just leave that there.

 

You say putting Covid before everything else means cancer etc. doesn’t get treated. Earlier you said it’s over 70s that are the issue. The prevalence amongst under 60s is rising fast according to the Lancet and BMJ.

A hospital full of Covid patients means other non Covid patients aren’t getting treated. An ICU bed with a Covid patient needs 7 nurses, a normal bed about two or three. By having hospitals full of Covid patients whether they survive or not ties up resources badly needed elsewhere, such as cancer.

Therefore stopping people getting Covid, and stopping people being hospitalised with it help non Covid clinics. Nurses, doctors and consultants I know personally and professionally over nearly 20 years in the healthcare industry are terrified of their hospitals being overwhelmed. They all say it’s not about the healthy under 40s being hospitalised, we tend to survive without intensive care, it’s that group transmitting it at home and work to older people who end up in ICU.

Arguing with Covid non believers, anti vaxxers and brexiteers is pointless.

 

Well have we are currently doing is working is it?

People dying, jobs being lost, businesses going under, savings being pointless. House market about to crash.

Great plan this.

 

no, what is currently happening isn't working and there are numerous reasons as to why. a list that's too long to go into.. one main reason, the "I'm alright Jack" brigade, it won't happen to me, stuff everyone else. until you know what Fordy, you hear those patients on the wards and on discharge they turned around and say "thank you, I had no idea." that's if they can get enough breaths to say it in one sentence.

or you have them turn up to an outpatient appointment whilst they are awaiting a result from a test having had to take one due to exposure and claim "I didn't know I should be isolating" whilst placing every single member of staff they come across at risk.

 

Do people still want you now you are 64 ?

Not both ?

 

Look, we are 9 months in here..

What we currently doing isn't working. I don't believe lockdowns work unless you use the time correctly which we haven't.

We've to be careful the cure isn't bigger than the problem which I believe it's starting to become the case.

 

Clearly wearing masks is working, just as evidently social distancing is working. Or maybe it isn't, the only thing that has been shown to work is total lockdown and that is not an option long term no matter what people believe.
We could and should have improved our infrastructure to the point where it could cope but we haven't, instead we have paid out billions to vested parties including new businesses that were set up without previous expertise or experience with dealing with pandemics.
I don't dispute that front line NHS staff are having a hard time of it, I spent 18 years working in the NHS so I can understand. I also have family members who currently are front line NHS workers so I hear the stories.

 

Do people still want you now you are 64 ?

You were doing so well until you threw brexit into it. We are out, we have a deal for free trade and within 10 years will have the strongest economy in Europe and half a dozen other countries following us out.

Get over it, its happened, and there's no going back.

 

it's quite clear you're not living in the real world Fordy. I usually agree with a bit of what you say but I can say confidence that with this, you have no idea what you are talking about. maybe you'd think differently if the shoe was on the other foot.

 

"Unfortunately, putting covid before everything else has meant others have died from not getting treatment for cancer etc."

No see that's framed incorrectly. Covid itself has put itself at the forefront. there's NO room. None. By law you cannot turn away a patient that needs help. Do you really think hospitals lack that much common sense? What happens if a patient has a course of chemo then contracts covid? Most likely death.

"Oh and how do you know these vaccines are 2-3 months away? Doesn't seem that why today does it?"
Sooner. They are probably a few weeks away not months. A few days according to the FT https://www.ft.com/content/61938eba-0ca3-436d-a043-89ac80d5c87a