Most liked posts in thread: Pro Palestine march rememberance Sunday

Those noises were being made by plenty on that march. And again, the mass turnout speaks to the anti-semitic mindset in my opinion. You've referenced Israel's 'indiscriminate slaughter' in Gaza. I won't deny that there are mass civilian casualties, which is horrific, but those causalities are a consequence of seeking out and destroy a Hamas group who embeds itself amongst the population, who has been reported as preventing Gazan's from seeking to leave the country in refuge and who used the aid funding provided not to help its people, but build a mass of underground tunnels.

The indiscriminate slaughter came from Hamas, who launched a battalion sized invasion of Israel to deliberately target, kidnap, rape, torture and murder civilians. A filmed themselves doing it, in glee. Supported by Gazans, celebrating their 'accomplishments'. Most of what took place is so horrific, I won't repeat it on here, but I was reading of one report from the associated press, of a family who were forced to watch as their baby was placed into an oven to be roasted alive, before being killed themselves. What on earth is Israel supposed to do? Its surrounded by an ideology that openly calls for its destruction and backs that narrative with action.

Its a complex issue, with grievances on 'both sides', so its extremely difficult to unpick. But imagine any other country in the world having to endure what Israel did on 7th Oct, then responding with military force only to see mass protests in support of the country who committed those horrific acts!

 

The vast majority of the people on these matches have no sympathy whatsoever for Israel and Jewish people who were subjected to the shocking attack on October 7th.

I would also say the vast majority of them are so full of hate for the Jewish people that they want Israel obliterated from the map.

 

That whole scenario yesterday was a massive set up. The Palestine march on the same day, the apparent 'far right' (lol) turning up with Tommy Robinson, can't believe folk are so blind not to see it. Dear me, just take me back to the days when armistice Day stood for the remembrance of the fallen in conflict, not some willy waving exercise by nutjob lefties and right wing flag winkers.

 

You're wasting your time Idle.

 

The answer is simple. The government should ban ALL marches and parades on Armistice day and remembrance Sunday. 2 days out of 365 is not a lot to give up

 

There are forecast to be nearly 500,000 people going to London for the March tomorrow. Most will be ordinary liberal people who are appalled at the slaughter currently being perpetrated by both sides and who want a ceasefire.
A very small proportion will be the sadly ignorant exceptions, cherry picked by the Telegraph and Mail, who are living in a cave and unaware of the role that Hamas terrorism has played in causing this humanitarian disaster. A similarly small proportion will be unaware of the genuine fears that Israelis hold about the security of their country and the intentions of Hamas to see it wiped from the face of the earth. But most will simply see the mass slaughter currently happening and want it stopped.
Many will have followed the modern history of the region and seen the role that Netanyahu’s nasty right wing government have played in supporting the illegal occupation of Palestinian territory, making Palestinians living in Israel into second class citizens and undermining the possibility of a two state solution, thereby giving succour to the likes of Hamas, who have no interest in compromise for the benefit of both sides.

It has been obvious for decades that unless more could be done to secure land and rights for the descendants of those displaced by the (justified) creation of the modern Israeli state, there would never be peace and that terrorist acts from the antisemitic Arab extremes would continue to occur. I have several Jewish friends who are obviously appalled, but not surprised, by the recent Hamas atrocities, but also scathing about the Jewish government’s role in exacerbating the conditions in which such terrorism flourishes.

Sadly, there will of course be a vocal minority attending Sundays March who are either anti-Israel, antisemitic or pro Hamas (or all three). These people are led by the nose by their religious rabble rousers and cause their entire communities to be labelled as extremists.
And, of course there will be plenty looking on (including on here) who see the world in simplistic terms and want to see our hard won fundamental freedoms of expression removed because of the possible actions of a small minority.

 

If I was on holiday in Cyprus the last thing I'd be worrying about is Tommy Robinson paying respects to the fallen in conflict. You do realise he pays his respects every year don't you?

 

Would you have been allowed to march for your cause through the same route the Queens funeral took on the exact same day?

Of course not. "Total freedom" doesn't mean "do what you like", and in any case, "total freedom" doesn't and absolutely shouldn't exist. That isn't at all what the Allies fought and in many cases died for.

 

Good 'ole Offcomedun....still not reading the room.....

 

That's exactly what the woman on the video has done, can't you see the irony in that?

 

Jeez its like watching that documentary with Tom Moores daughter as you search for an excuse. Your post to Tony alluding to most people don't have views like him, well i've got news for you, most don't have views like you either. People on the left and right of the political spectrum are actually insignificant when it comes to a party being voted into power, its the views of the majority in the centre that make the difference. you know, the ones that have balance in their views and don't just read the Mail or the Guardian for their diatribe.

 

I have never claimed to represent the views of the majority. But I’m nowhere near as much in the minority as some people on this forum appear to believe. Sure, I’m to the left of centre, but nothing like as far to the left as you seem to think. I support Starmer FFS. I’m basically a Keynesian social democrat who would happily vote LibDem (and have done in the past) if I was living in a constituency where that would better oppose the Tories. I spent a lot of time in the past helping get rid of Militant from the Labour Party; I’ve never been in Momentum or any of the further left elements of the LP.

I’m simply trying to provide some balance to the socially right-leaning views frequently aired on this platform. Quite a few people on here who think their views are centrist are actually well to the right of mainstream. You have to take into account that this is a football supporters forum. Of course there is a wide range of views amongst football supporters but, taken as a whole, they tend heavily towards the socially conservative and only the most blinkered observer would deny that. This forum is most definitely not a representative sample of British voters. Huge swathes of our society have no interest in football, including a large majority on the left. I’m very much an outlier amongst my friends and peers as a person with leftist views who follows football. The composition of this forum is at least 95% male and it’s well established that far more women have socially liberal views than men. So that skews it well to the right for a start.
It’s also a forum based in a run down, post industrial city in the north of England with a very large population of Muslims and a lot of very disaffected white people. So that makes it highly unrepresentative of most political constituencies in this country and worlds away from the more populous South. By pretty much any metric you want to name, this forum is highly unrepresentative of British society as a whole.

My social views are unremarkably mainstream amongst university educated professional people, particularly those working in education, social care, the NHS etc. And that’s not the ‘Islington elite’ beloved of Daily Mail caricature - it’s millions of people around the country and a growing proportion of the electorate, as so many more young people now go into higher education. But, of course, it’s a demographic that is vastly underrepresented on these pages. So, attempting to paint me as some kind of extreme lefty with wildly unrepresentative views doesn’t wash, I’m afraid. It says far more about the limited social contacts of some posters on here than it does about me.

I strongly believe that most intelligent, moderate, centrist people (including most swing voters you correctly highlight) have a more balanced view of the current situation than is reflected on these pages. Of course, like any decent human being, they are appalled by the Hamas terrorist atrocities - that goes without saying. But most also recognise that Israel has not helped itself over the years by its refusal to compromise over Palestinian territorial security, its active promotion of the illegal settlers and now its indiscriminate slaughter in Gaza. But, on these pages, any attempt to add any balance to the ‘Palestinians bad, Israel good’ narrative gets you attacked as an extremist.

I know perfectly well that there were some people on the London march, and elsewhere, who hate Jews and want to see Israel wiped off the map. I unequivocally oppose and denounce those people; any who have carried antisemitic banners or shouted slogans comparing Israel to the Nazis should be identified and prosecuted with the full force of the law. But those people are the minority. Suggestions on these pages that anyone protesting in support of Palestinian rights supports Hamas and wants Israel destroyed are simply nonsense.

 

Says the man who thinks that Russia was justified to invade the sovereign state of Ukraine, kill its citizens and flatten its infrastructure. I’ll take no lectures on minority views from you, thank you very much.

 

Yeah, that I agree with. Again, just my view, but until the world disavows itself from religion, there'll never be peace.

 

Read the articles covered in the link, they've not got a completely left sided bias in them and it's actually a decent read.

I do agree with you in general terms about the guardian but not on the articles in the link, they seem a lot more balanced.

 

The Guardian have today bowed to pressure and removed ' A Letter to America' penned by Bin Laden in 2002 which contained amongst other things anti-Jewish prejudice, from their website. It's been available to read for the last 21 years apparently.

So much for them being neutral

 

Talking of being cancelled i don't know if you saw the interview with the UFC owner Dan White the other day where he was saying one of his companies sponsors asked him to remove a tweet stating his support for Donald Trump, can't remember the context. His reply? 'Go f*ck yourself' lol. Good to see someone with the balls to stand up to cancel culture.

 

And if you oppose the march you are deemed as 'far right' rather than moderate...!!
BTW where are our usual leftie forum residents on this (you know who you are)....?
Could it be that they are feeling compromised....?

 

Nazi Robinson and his right wing thugs have predictably turned up and are trying to cause as much trouble as possible.

 

Did you read the article Dave? As it says (and most sensible commentators agree) Netanyahu’s stated intent to eliminate Hamas is a pipe dream. (no pun intended). It won’t happen. The only way to get peace is to get a two state solution and give Palestinians a secure homeland and a viable economy. Support for Hamas would quickly dissipate in those circumstances. Most people just want to live secure, peaceful lives.

I fully understand the desire/necessity to eliminate the tunnels in Gaza. I don’t believe that carpet bombing tens of thousands of innocent civilians, denying them water, food and fuel supplies, etc etc is the way to do it. It seems to me that there is a strong revenge motive from Netanyahu going on here. I don’t believe he cares how many innocent civilians he kills, as long as he appeases the ultra Orthodox religious extremists who are keeping him in power.