Cost of Living Crisis

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/sep/24/keir-starmer-unveils-green-growth-plan-to-counter-liz-trusss-tax-cuts?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

At last, some significant big ideas from Labour. Anyone but the most delusional climate change denier - hi Tony - can see that this is the sensible way forward.

The contrast between Labour managing the the economy for the benefit of everyone, including future generations, and the Tories giving money to the rich in the hope that they will trickle down their wealth to us plebs, should now be clear for all to see.

 

Tories: "We're going to give millions of pounds to the already rich, most of whom are in the south of England. Ordinary working people, especially those from the north, Wales, Scotland etc - go feck yourselves".

 

May I politely remind you that there are very few climate change deniers, but what there is is a vast majority of folk that don't believe that the situation is man made nor can be stopped by changing our way of life as the eco nutters would have us believe.
Climate change is a natural phenomenon way way beyond our control and you can check back with me in 2000 years and we can discus which one of us was right ...

 

Of course climate change has always happened. But never at this extreme pace, before industrialisation.

Funny how the only people who don't think that human activity is exacerbating extreme climate change are those with rigid right wing views and those with a vested interest in the fossil fuel industry. The vast majority of scientists and ordinary people now accept that we have to do things differently for the sake of future generations.

 

Yes they do. They’re lining the pockets of their mates and donors.

 

No they don't, they don't give a monkeys , there is no need for any panic, get on with your lives and have your bacon sandwich and milk in your coffee, don't believe the hype, trust me....

 

You have to wonder why after 13 years of Labour government under Blair and Brown the Labour Party lost the 2010 election they were doing such a great job.

 

I'm not really sure what that has to do with the current situation.
Labour lost the 2010 election because the bankers crashed the global economy. Cameron very cleverly managed to pin the blame on Labour and Labour stupidly allowed the 'Labour overspending' lie to go unchallenged.
Compare how well off people were in 2010 to now. The Tories have absolutely decimated the standard of living for everyone except the rich. The last twelve years has seen the most economically incompetent government in living memory, by a country mile.

 

Agree, by spending and wasting more money than even a Labour government would...

 

There's both isn't there? A cut in the standard rate helps everyone and a cut in the top rate helps the top 650,000 earners and simplifies the system. Not every tax change has to benefit the poor and punish the rich.

The energy subsidy helps everyone.

So to say that most ordinary people aren't getting anything is plainly wrong surely. The just majority of the costs from this mini budget are directly from reducing the burden on normal people.

 

Is that what we class as a big idea now? Taking the exact same government proposals and moving them forward by 5 years?

Truly revolutionary. The bar is so low.

 

Yes and since then we have had 13 years of austerity yet Labour have not been able to put a manifesto forward with policies that would get them elected that's the worry Steve.
God forbid if come the next election they don't have policies that can win the next General Election with a workable majority after the debacle this country is in.

 

Thats an easy one Broncs, Gordon Brown for the 2010 election and probably Kier Starmer with the next one, Labour has lost its soul and loves a Duff leader and when it does pick a winner that wins elections it cannot wait to get rid and go back to the cosy position of opposition where it can carp on and complain to its hearts content

 

How is announcing a massive programme of green energy infrastructure simply rehashing existing government proposals? This government is backtracking on all previous commitments to green energy and ploughing ahead with fracking and more oil drilling. The contrast between the two approaches is stark.

 

Hope you're right and it's not just talk ..

 

I'm not a voter, I've done it once in my life and have my reasons for not doing so. But if anyone with a shred of decency votes Tory after what we have seen in the past few years I think you need to be ashamed at the choice you have made.
I like to think the world has some decency left, the Tories as a party have none.

 

Think i've said before, lots of folk, me included, are not voting FOR the tories as much as voting AGAINST the others...

 

The cut in the standard rate does little or nothing for those on very low wages, who already pay little or no income tax anyway. And for average earners the cut will be easily outweighed by the consequent effects of the falling pound putting up food and fuel costs. So the vast majority of the population will likely be worse off, not better.
The only people who will benefit are those who already have plenty of wealth and don't need any more.

https://www.itv.com/news/2022-09-24/analysis-finds-only-the-very-richest-households-to-benefit-from-tory-tax-cuts

The government is gambling that giving the rich more money will result in increased investment in the economy. All the evidence of the last few decades is that it won't. It's an article of faith for the free market zealots that giving 'incentives' to the rich will encourage them to grow the economy, but it has never worked - they simply spend it on themselves and their kids or squirrel it away overseas to avoid paying (even the lower) tax. It's doomed to failure, which is why the markets have reacted so badly. And Kwarteng promising even more unfunded tax cuts has spooked the markets even more, making a bad situation worse. These Children of Thatcher in government don't seem to understand that no one outside their small club of right wing fundamentalists believes in Friedman and Hayek any more. They have badly misjudged the international reaction to their loopy, outdated ideas.

 

I'm sorry Tone, I wouldn't normally go against what people decide, it's personal choice after all. That said, in my life time I've never seen such disdain for the general public of this country than I have from this government to a point where I have found it insulting to my intelligence. And after that mini budget it just reinforces my beliefs.