COVID-19

How many of the infections per day are omicron?

How many does that leave that are Delta?

We're just making stuff up now.

 

Sorry I was meaning pre omicron. Sorry if that wasn't clear. We still had big issues - with most people jabbed we would not have had those issues and approx. 100,000k people wouldn't now have long COVID from during that period, not to mention the people who wouldn't be dead who are.

 

Also when (hopefully) really highly effective treatments for COVID come online I wonder how many unvaccinated will refuse those when seriously ill because they are 'experimental'.

 

But vaccinated people would still have got Delta - as they've always done - and Omicron would still have happened.

So what would vaccine passports as a population strategy actually have achieved?

 

Ok - as usual I think we're at crossed purposes

I don't see what is controversial about the face that our health outcomes would be better if everyone were vaccinated.

Do you want to go back to the days of kids dying of measles?

 

Thats because you change the basis of what we're talking about.

So no, you're right. It would be better, but not perfect, if everyone was vaccinated. People would still get Delta though and people will still get Omicron.

That's theory.

Back in the real world though. Even with vaccine passports not everyone will still get vaccinated. Both vaccinated and unvaccinated would have got Delta and will get Omicorn.

So what would vaccine passports have solved?

And the whole point if you are simply using vaccine passports as a way to control compliance, at least be honest that you're expelling people from society rather than hiding behind it being for the greater good.

 

I don't think I'm doing anything with vaccine passports. This isn't Boris you know I'm not sat in downing street having a party.

They don't solve anything but they do increase vaccination rates and therefore improve outcomes. That is not theory, it is fact based on the experience of countries that have introduced them.

I've agreed that introducing them without being honest about why is counterproductive.

Expelling people from society lol!

Discussed much earlier - rights and responsibilities. We won't agree on this so let's agree to differ.

Just don't debate with my mum - she wants to round the unvaccinated up and inter them all. I'm the liberal wing of the family lol.

 

You see. This is why we're going round in circles. With regards to vaccine passports you said this...."the aim is to protect people and stop the virus" and vaccine passports do neither. Very crucially because vaccines don't stop the virus so it falls down at the first hurdle.

I mean....they do exclude people from elements of society. That's not even debatable.

They increase vaccination rates but not to the level where it protects the general population or stops the virus. Therefore they quite clearly don't do the aim that you stated.

 

I see you're arguing for mandatory vaccination then. Quite radical of you. Got to say I didn't see that one coming

 

No. Because that still wouldn't stop the virus

It's quite simple. If you don't want to get severe symptoms, get the vaccines.

If you are happy to increase your risk of getting severe symptoms and or potentially dying then its up to you.

 

Welsh government have announced spectators are banned from all indoor, outdoor, professional and community sports events in Wales from 26 December.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-59729129

 

The Covid Pass working well then.

Drakeford sounds a right laugh, an over promoted Librarian.

 

Ban people from outside sport stadium but as far as I've seen cinema, theatres etc are all fine?

I think all of us just want consistency in rules

 

It's doing something to be seen to be doing something. There is no plan, it's the same failed efforts over and over. Throwing certain sectors under the bus time and time again when there is little sign they are mass spreading events whilst seeing people enter hospital and catching it in the place they should be safest but this still hasn't been addressed is bonkers.

 

Should close everything down within the M25 and let us get on with things as normal...

 

that is exactly what happened 12 months ago for about a week until we followed into Tier 4 and then full lockdown in January

 

Rishi has announced grants for hospitality and some others which match those available when they had to close previously. Does this imply they will be closing soon?

 

Sure they will, maybe open them all up as booster vaccination centres..!!

 

£6k won't go far, and what about the wages of those who would be put out of work even if for a short time?