Brexit

It will, because at least 21 Tory seats will have a more 'leave' orientated candidate, the voters will be much more (inc labour) clearer on their choice...

 

It may change what many MPs are refusing to by not implementing the a referendum vote, at the monent that is the top of the political agenda and must be sorted.
I dont like that it will have to go to the country again but a straight forward vote remain or leave with or without a deal, no ifs or butts.

 

That's not what I said Dave.
All this angst was caused because the referendum ballot paper did not define what 'Leave' meant. We were repeatedly told by the Leave campaign that No Deal wouldn't happen - it was just scaremongering and we would easily get a deal. People voted narrowly to leave on that basis. If Leave had campaigned on an explicitly No Deal ticket they would have comfortably lost. You can't get a narrow victory for an undefined Brexit and then use it as a mandate for the most extreme version - that's totally undemocratic.

I know many Remainers. Everyone I've talked to has said that they would accept a the result of a referendum in which the real choices are made explicit. The public should be given a genuine choice between May's deal (which is only deal available, whatever Johnson may say otherwise), No Deal, or Remain, on a single transferable vote. If No Deal won that vote the majority of Remainers would accept that as the will of the people. What we can't accept is being told that voting Leave meant leaving with a deal and now being told it meant No Deal, when that's not what many voted for.

 

Not sure what you mean.
I am congratulating you on a post that very much say what I feel with regards this referendun fiasco.

 

Dave, do you trust them at all? We go to another vote, whats to stop them vetoing it again if they don't get the vote they want? Signing up for the EU is like signing up to a cult, once you're in you ain't getting out.

 

Let me help......
Leave means erm, let me think, ah yes got it...............LEAVE
Remain means......STAY + more of the same
Not too difficult eh..?

 

So if we do have the vote you proposing and the vote theoretically go like this,

Leave no deal 26%
Leave deal 26%
Remain 48%

Who wins?

 

I honestly believe as @TonyWilkinson says the new Tory MPs replacing those that had the whip taken away will be replaced by Eurosceptic/breixteers it will be a straight choice with regards the political parties, the Brexit party will have a massive effect on the forth coming GE.
I believe Labour are going to get a shock with regards the died in the wool past Labour supporters certainly in South Yorkshire, it might take a Tory/Brexit coailtion but I believe that is the only way to end this fiasco.
If Corbyn takes up the request for a GE it could be done and dusted before the next extention is up.
I do believe we will have to ask for an extention I hope this time Macron stays strong and veto's the request.

 

Exactly , the leave vote is split in 2 , you cannot have 3 options on a referendum ballot paper, sussed that right at the beginning, glad you're catching on...!!

 

Hopefully Macron has a minute or two spare in between beating his own people up.

 

I betcha the remain vote would claim victory. Best of 5?

 

That kind of logic will probably be commonplace for any future voting now..

 

Either that or rock, paper, scissors.

 

This is the great Brexiteer delusion - that if we stamp our feet and threaten to leave without a deal then the EU will cave in and offer us more, including removal of the backstop.

It's utter b0llocks. It's not going to happen. We can threaten all we like - the EU will wave us off into the sunset.

The EU doesn't want us to leave without a deal - it will hurt them financially (albeit not as much as it will hurt us). But they are much more concerned about protecting the integrity of the single market and customs union and supporting Ireland. There is no threat that we can make that will persuade them to change the fundamentals of their philosophy and cave in. The stuff we were told before the referendum about how desperate the EU would be to do a deal was always nonsense, as I said at the time.

The liar Johnson knows all this perfectly well. All this crap about 'surrender bills' and cutting the legs off his negotiations is just smoke and mirrors. He wants to crash us out without a deal (in order to maintain the support of his hard right ERG colleagues) but he wants to blame it on Labour so he can win a General Election.
He has no realistic proposals for an improved deal, and no intention of getting one, because he knows that none is possible unless we move away from May's red lines. If he did succeed in getting a unicorn deal he'd lose the support of the ERG, who are only interested in No Deal, so he isn't even trying to get one.

 

Thank you, you have just highlighted all the reasons why only 'no deal' can be the only way forward...

 

In your simplistic right wing Colonel Blimp world, then maybe.
In the real world, not so much.

If you campaign for weeks before a vote saying No Deal is not an option, and call your opponents scaremongers for even suggesting it may happen, then you can't use a narrow victory as a mandate for a No Deal Brexit.
Is that too complicated for you to understand?

 

Yeah....my brain hurts....

 

What is this obsession with a deal or am i missing a trick here? Are we leaving or not?

 

It would be a two stage process Al. Everyone would vote for first and second options. The option getting the least votes drops out, then the second preferences are used to decide the winner between the two options left standing.
It's a perfectly simply system called Single Transferrable Vote that is widely used in many types of elections.
Simple and democratic and everyone could recognise the validity of the result, whichever way it went.
The result you have posited - ie an absolute tie between two options in the first round - would never realistically happen in real world voting. Whichever of your two 26% options had the most votes - even if only by one vote - would move to the second stage, when second preferences would be counted.

 

We don't need a deal to leave, all the trade arrangements etc can be dealt with after...