George Floyd copper

Irony at it's very best huh?

 

They’ll burn them to the ground once they’ve cleared the aisles of the 70% discounted shit tat

 

Ha I was just about to post the very same thing. Agianst the slave trade as long as it doesn't affect their supply of dirt cheap clothes and the latest smart phones.

 

And the World goes round.

 

Its called sybolism and of course Hypocrisy .

 

Jeez, you really ought to stay clear of the right wing conspiracy websites. First you're linking speeches by individualist extremist Jordan Peterson, with his 'Marxists everywhere' paranoia and grab bag of Aunt Sallys and half truths. Then you're citing loony 'globalist' conspiracy theories about George Soros that the far right use to discredit any kind of liberal-leaning protest.

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/right-trying-link-george-soros-george-floyd-protests-don-t-ncna1225446

 

Written by a Tory:
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/toppling-a-statue-isn-t-erasing-history-it-s-writing-it?fbclid=IwAR3EduEIHw8Gv1B4yys8iimu1z4GPOZ_GjUmlQPXeHclvfv0G1ksSQQRnsk

There's a very long and proud hisory of statue-toppling going back thousands of years and across many cultures and countries. Statues aren't history lessons, they are glorifications. The history is written down. Nobody forgets the history just because the statues aren't there any more.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/17/world/controversial-statues-monuments-destroyed.html

 

Do you think we should be pulling the pyramids down?

 

@Offcomedun , perhaps you should steer clear of ultra- left wing anti - semetic Labour sites . Racism and slavery is still rife in India - Pakistan - Bangladesh - China - North Korea - Uzbekistan - Liberia , . 100s of BAME people queing outside Primark today buying clothes produced by slaves in Bangladeshi slave sweat shops , double standards and hypocrisy of the highest order , perhaps these arn't the correct types of blacks to fit in the Naz Shah and Labour parties Letter sent to Pritti Patel , it's double standards , perhaps Hadrians wall - the Colleseum , the various Roman monuments and staues all over Europe and Africa should be pulled down . ISIS destroyed all things they regarded has anti - islamic and were rightly condemmed for it . Yet you promote the removal of Historical images of our heritage and airbrush them away . I bet you read the Guardian , will you stop reading this has the 1st editors of this rag supported the Confederates in the American Civil war and were outraged calling it a sad day for whites in America when Lincoln ( another slave owner ) was elected President , should this historical paper not close down and reflect on it's racist roots ?.

 

Great Wall of China?

 

Are the waves of oppression and slavery still impacting black lives in America now? Yes.

Are the waves of oppression and slavery still impacting descendants of pyramid builders? No.

 

It's a valid point isn't it RT and people who hold the ideologies behind pulling statues must surely feel the same about some of the greatest monuments in the world.

 

Slavery and oppression is impacting many more black people in Africa, now, today. Ditto for child slaves in Asia.
I think there's a point to the history of Slavery being taught, not just historically but also to help outline why and how its shaped cultures of today. But from what I see, there's much an element of 'show you recognize your inherited racism and privilege'. Of repentance and shame, and dare I say it - revenge. And slavery has afflicted white cultures too - not that its about scoring points, i'm just pointing out that Slavery has never been specific to black cultures or history.

 

Absolutely it's an issue right now. That's what should be the world agenda right now that the issue is exposed.

My point is about the usual 'whataboutery' from the same people the whole time.

But what about white lives matter?
But what about music of white origin?
But what about international men's day?
But what about straight pride?
But what about slaves who built the pyramids?

It's utterly irrelevant to the issue.

 

Fair point.

Forgetting the specific notion of whether people agree that black lives matter, because apart from a vast minority of morons, everyone agrees to that point. But in my opinion 'the movement' would attract more empathy from more people if it sought to address issues from within the black community too. If Black Lives Matter, shouldn't they always matter? Shouldn't they matter when Black lives are taken by other Black people, not just by white police officers? Shouldn't the underlying factors which drive higher rates of crime and poverty in some black communities be explored fully and not assumed to be entirely down to racial oppression? I want to be clear - that doesn't detract from dealing with issues that DO have a racial element. But I come back to the fundamental, underlying point. Go after the primary cause(s), not symptoms. The primary cause is poverty. And there are historic, racial and cultural elements to that equation.

 

No, of course not.
The pyramids, Great Wall of China, Machu Pichu, Hadrian's Wall, Stonehenge, the Parthenon, half of the historic buildings in Rome, etc etc ad nauseum, are historic wonders of the world. No doubt slaves were made to work in their construction but they aren't commemorations of slavery. The world would be a much poorer place if they were dismantled.
Statues like that of Colston are just bits of bronze, with no great artistic merit and are simply there to aggrandise the subject of the statue. Nobody goes to Bristol to visit the Colston statue or treks for days to look at Cecil Rhodes' likeness, do they? They are no great loss to anyone and taking them down removes a visible affront to the descendants of the slaves they sold, mistreated and murdered. There are lots of much better testaments to our historic achievements than these statues.

I'm not actually advocating the systematic removal of all sorts of dubious reminders of our colonial past. I just find it pathetic the way that some people get all precious and protective about images of people they never knew, had often never heard of and who would have treated them like dirt had they been alive in their day. The history is still the history whether the statues are there or not. And we aren't going to descend into anarchy because a few statues get taken down. What's the big deal?

 

But the statues aren't commemorations of slavery are they? The majority are there for the positive contributions they made to the local community. I just think it's a very dangerous idea to pick and choose what you apply an ideology to, you either pick what you believe and follow it regardless of what it is your talking about.

Your last paragraph I agree with but also flip the coin, the same people wanting to pull these statues down have probably never heard of these people before and never affected their life so what do they get from it? I don't understand what the aim is of it.

 

Bottom line though that there is a procedure to remove statues whether you agree with them or not, surely that's one bit of democracy that can be saved from the anarchic mob if we have any chance of continuing in a civilised society...

 

I have no problem with local statues Coming down provided The majority of people living in those locales Want that but no way should the statues of national figures such as Churchill Francis Drake or Baden Powell be touched. I do think that most of the BLM movement are much less bothered about that than they are of making the country less racist

 

Vote in a Labour Lord Mayor of London job done.