COVID-19

Its what needs to happen. A mass rebellion by the hospitality and events industries if June 21 doesn't go ahead. Sadly, there's too many people who lack the balls to make it happen.

 

why are you ignoring my question though? to answer it for you, the delta variant isn't spreading in the US like it is here as one of the countries did a better job with its borders.

and you are trying to argue a purely hypothetical situation that I made who is not a medical professional. proving or disproving one statement i made a day ago does nothing for the general conversation and now just feels like point scoring.

and this; If we work on the basis that 2 jabs reduces hopitalisations by 95% and one jab reduces hospitalisations by 75% based on the above data we would likely see a hospitalisation rate as followed based on the pandemic running it's course with the current vaccination roll out. is slightly misleading as it doesn't take the delta veriant into account. the worry around that is why freedom day will most likely be postponed for 2/4 weeks.

 

It definitely is just incoming US tourists to Europe.

The US continues to ban entry to visitors from all of the Schengen zone, UK, Brazil, South Africa, etc to limit the spread of Covid.

So I believe your statement that people from the 61 countries can now fly to the US but you can't is incorrect. It therefore follows that the US aren't scaremongering - but perhaps those people who mis-state how the actual restrictions work are?

 

I have not ignored your question, I have answered it. The restrictions from the UK to USA is the same both ways, I even posted the risk levels for you and pointed out we are at level 3 which is the same level as the 61 countries you refer to.

The figures I have worked my scenario from are heavily weighted to doom because they include period of putting untest elderly people into care homes, they include the time of the unvaccinated Kent variant and peak flu season. If anything they are over estimates rather than under estimates.

 

fair then must have misread the article

 

but they are unsure of delta.... thats the whole point. how can we make decisions when there is no data.

 

I am not an anti vaxxer and far from it but what is the end game of this? Why are we now encouraging everyone to get a vaccine which would have no real impact on saving lives in that age group? Are we saying have it just in case or because we’ve bought too many?
We still do not know full side effects so I’d say like anything give it to those who need it and if they have it then move on with our lives.
We are not currently in a lockdown. Far from it. You can do everything and anything and I imagine if the virus is spreading what we are doing is not stopping it. Schools are open, pubs/restaurants supermarkets. You name it you can do it apart from watch outdoor social events or go to a nightclub. The rest you can do. We have this faux closing borders scenario where we hand select countries you can and can’t go to probably based on our trade deals with them.

What we are doing now is not stopping the spread. Are you suggest we lockdown again for 4 weeks to stop this delta variant? Or are you saying we just don’t open back up fully on 21 June?

I am all for a full hard lockdown for 4 weeks when we needed it last year and it had to be a real one. No movement of people etc. But this we have got now is lockdown in name only and nothing else

 

Your first comment is an hard one to get to grips with, I am with you and at some point I think another will pop up. like I have said before I would rather they wait and re open everything once rather than open now and then lockdown again in autumn. also if we do end up locking down again in autumn I will be pissed.
What we are doing now is not stopping the spread. Are you suggest we lockdown again for 4 weeks to stop this delta variant? Or are you saying we just don’t open back up fully on 21 June? the latter, a full lockdown now makes no sense in my opinion. the delta variant currently doesn't seem that bothersome, it's just hospitalizations are higher with a first dose than the government would like. give them time to assemble some data and its most likely that 2 doses still provide good protection.

 

The delta variant, the one rampaging in India?



The one that is now falling in Bolton, that hasn't caused a spike in hospitalisation or seen an increase in deaths. That has seen 3 people who have been jabbed twice end up in hospital and has been around for over a month?

What benefit can you point to for additional restrictions to people who do not get hospitalised or die of covid till everyone is vaccinated?

Once we are happy with the Delta variant, do we bunker up when the next variant comes along as that might be vaccine resistant. What is your end game?

 

I keep repeating myself. all i have said, is we wait and see for a few weeks. india's testing is very low so cannot provide a full picture of what's going on over there. if you think you have trumped government policy over a single graph more power to you.

Once we are happy with the Delta variant, do we bunker up when the next variant comes along as that might be vaccine resistant. What is your end game? literally answered a very similar question to the one before yours. just included the whole message so you can read it.

 

genuinely i think if a vaccine resistant one comes about we will be back square one whether we like it or not. BUT if most people are vaccinated the amount of virus circulating is lower. (so the chance of it mutating) are lower! but god forbid that happens it won't be good.

 

The chances of it mutating do not really matter on what happens here. The "Delta" variant was from overseas anyway.

A doctor explained variants well yesterday on the radio.

He says when you see your mate Bob you recognise him. If Bob changes his hair you still know it is bob. The changes in the virus are tiny and change all the time but they are basically the same thing (Look at HIV, it has been around since 1982 and currently 35m are living with HIV, it's still basically the same virus it was in 1982). The way the government is acting it's as if each variant of Bob changes his height, weight, gender, age, etc so Bob isn't Bob anymore.

However these people who are medical experts but don't ramp up the fear factor aren't actually given airtime as it doesn't make for good TV, thats why Dr Ravi Gupta gets the airtime because he suggests the world will end such we continue down Boris's roadmap.

 

your HIV point is a good one. lets hope there are no mutations anyway. great debate lets hope this all gets sorted soon either way.

 

8 out of 10 people in the UK currently have antibodies apparently? I know they're not the most accurate measure of protection but come on!!!

 

But 2 don't!! And if the variants get together and have variant babies, think about how many deaths won't happen despite the doomsday predictions of SAGE?!

 

I've had a look at the data, if we reopen on the 21st June the outlook is grim, as seen here.

There are 40m not fully vaccinated people out there.

 

Was there an alternative waiting years for it to be tested as with most vaccines would have been a catastrophic, lives on hold for years and all that goes with that sort of scenario, I'm not disagreeing with you're point but couldn't see any other way forward without the vaccine.

 

I'm wrapping my house in shrink wrap as we speak.