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Brexit

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by Park bantam, Jun 14, 2018.

  1. alex

    alex Fringe Player

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    Who’d have thought this would all end in tears with our £350m a week nowhere to be seen.....
     
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  2. Chris Withe

    Chris Withe Fringe Player

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    I'm certain that I didn't deny the result of the referendum in my previous reply. When even politicians that are well versed in the minutiae of leaving the EU can't agree on what that actually means. Then how do you know that your 'thoughts and wishes' tally with others that voted that way?

    From what I've read and heard in the two years since the vote. It seems to me that the Indian parable of the blind men and the elephant is particularly applicable. In that, there's no consensus on what it is, which in turn has to mean the vote in itself was anything but an informed one.
     
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  3. Tolly856

    Tolly856 Squad Player

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  4. Tony Wilkinson

    Tony Wilkinson Squad Player
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    The only 'fight' the left has would manifest itself in holding protest marches and/or civil disruption....
    Just has they left a note saying" sorry, there is no money left" then we should send one to Brussels saying " goodbye, you know where we are if you need to talk to us".....
     
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  5. Rogered Tart

    Rogered Tart Regular Starter
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    That is wrong, very wrong. You are naive if you think people voted to give control to the set of most incompetent members of parliament we have ever had and that includes all parties in this. I, as a leave voter, went to the ballot box to vote for change. I did not vote for the people paid to implement this change. The fact they are utterly useless is no fault of the peple who voted.
     
  6. WilsdenBantam

    WilsdenBantam Squad Player
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    It's coming home!!!
     
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  7. Tolly856

    Tolly856 Squad Player

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    Are you telling me that controlling borders , controlling laws, sovereignty, being able to strike our own trade deals (control) and breaking free of the EU so we can make our own decisions (more control) were not major factors in leaving the EU?

    I disagree that Brexit voters are not at fault for Brexit. What could Theresa May have done differently? How for example would she be able to control our borders without leaving the largest free-trading single market on the planet? It turns out that contrary to the myth before the vote, you can't. How would we strike trade deals which are just as lucrative as the ones we have now (or better as some were telling us prior to leaving) when we are going to go from having a pull power/overall market of over 500M customers to 65M? What can she do about the decrease in the number of EU doctors coming here and businesses announcing a decrease in investment due to the Brexit vote? Jaguar for example have announced that 80M worth of investment over the next 5 years is in jeopardy because of Brexit. The only viable solution to this is staying in the customs union and if we stay in the customers Union, we can't deliver 'the will of the people'. Damned if she does, damned if she doesn't. The list goes on and on and on.

    It's easy to blame others, but I've yet to see a viable solution given from a single Brexit voter which would make Brexit better and help solve issues such as some of the above. Even the people in charge don't have a clue and contrary to popular belief, most of them are far more intelligent than your average Joe and I include myself in that bracket. When you vote for the unknown and it doesn't go to plan, you've got to take responsibility for it.

    It is also worth remembering that all of these questions have an answer if you go with the theory of the EU needing us more than we need them. Meanwhile in the real world...
     
  8. Rogered Tart

    Rogered Tart Regular Starter
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    You don't agree with me, i certainly don't agree with you. I'll leave it there or we will go round in circles.
     
  9. Nottsy

    Nottsy Squad Player

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    The only thing about voting for Brexit I could possibly understand, is the protest vote, totally understandable...What I don’t understand, and probably never will, is the worship of utter cünts like Farage, Rees-Mogg, Johnson, Redwood etc..Huge swathes of decent, hard working men and women, totally persuaded that these demagogues are speaking for them.... I mean, Rees-Mogg FFS! What a Tw@t.
     
    #69 Nottsy, Jul 10, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2018
  10. trevor

    trevor Squad Player
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    Most of this post is in fact biased opinion masquerading as fact from what appears to be a committed socialist remainer, It is only a matter of time before he calls for the referendum to be run again, It is what the losing side always does
     
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  11. Park bantam

    Park bantam Regular Starter
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    The fact is the country and all politicians are split down the middle over this issue I just can’t see a way forward without another vote
     
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  12. Tolly856

    Tolly856 Squad Player

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    Why don't you argue against them then? We can't close our borders and stay in the single market as some believed before the vote- fact. The alternative of trading under WTO rules as a single independent nation wouldn't be as lucrative as our current trade deal- fact. The number of EU doctor applications have dropped- fact. Jaguar have announced that £80M worth of investment is in jeopardy as a direct result of Brexit- fact. And last but not least, it turns out that the EU don't need use more than we need them. Who'd have thought?
     
  13. trevor

    trevor Squad Player
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    The threat of going straight to WTO would leave us immensely better off eventually due to agreeing trade agreements with our biggest trade partner as a country the USA, add India to this and other emerging markets would make us much more prosperous than a declining market of some 430 million of only half have enough money to actually benefit our trade,
    The tariffs alone would add £billions to our finances as the EU import far more to the UK than we do to them,
    Make no mistake the EU cannot afford the UK going to WTO terms and the threat would soon have them scurrying after us instead of our weak useless politicians trying to please them and dangling on the EU string,
    BTW the deal May is proposing is a really poor deal that will be ripped to shreds by the EU
     
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  14. Dennis

    Dennis Captain
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    The usual riposte to leaving the EU is we could always trade under WTO rules. And that is certainly true as a simple statement.

    And when we leave the EU, we will lose all rights to trade with other countries under a current free trade agreement because we only do so at the moment as a member of the EU. We won't choose to trade under WTO rules, we will have no alternative. And to add a dose of reality to that, every other country in the world (bar one) which trades under WTO rules only does so as an addition to all of their own bi-lateral trade agreement and trading bloc agreements. Every other country in the world, has spent decades and decades negotiating free trade agreements with other countries or within their own trading bloc. Using WTO rules is a fallback position for every country in the world (bar 1) and it's why only 1 country relies on it exclusively - that great powerhouse Mauritania! Once the UK leaves the EU, we'll be starting again trying to negotiate these free trade agreements will all and sundry and be in exactly the same position as Mauritania. We will have to rely on WTO rules exclusively. Maybe we'll start our negotiations on future trade agreements with Mauritania as a trial and to gain some experience before we start on the big players such as the US, India, Brazil, Australia, Japan, South Korea, Argentina etc etc and of course not forgetting EU27.

    Whatever the reasons for people voting in the Referendum, I doubt anybody would have voted to make the United Kingdom poorer than we were at the time. But that will be the case if we adopt WTO rules.
     
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  15. Nottsy

    Nottsy Squad Player

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    Forget the industry experts...Everybody listen to Trev.
     
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  16. trevor

    trevor Squad Player
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  17. Tolly856

    Tolly856 Squad Player

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    Ask yourself why no other country on the planet apart from Mauritania trade solely under WTO rules. Surely more would do it if it leaves you immensely better off?
     
  18. Tolly856

    Tolly856 Squad Player

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    Could you rewrite your post in a different format so it's easier to respond too? @trevor@trevor
     
  19. WilsdenBantam

    WilsdenBantam Squad Player
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    Hehe Mauritania, sounds like something too smoke.
     
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  20. trevor

    trevor Squad Player
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