Match Thread Home v Oldham Athletic 3pm Saturday 20th March

If I’m right didn’t Newport and Carlisle both lose their next games after beating us. What’s the betting Oldham do the same.

I wonder if T&S know we aren’t good enough to attack in numbers because we’ll get ripped open on the counter. Better safe than sorry.

You can see the be frustration in Rowe because he consistently marked by 3 men and has his back to goal for the majority of the games. Can T&S come up with an attacking philosophy whilst maintaining a strong defence?

 

There's a very one dimensional view on here and what people need to do is step back and appreciate how a strength can also be a weakness.

T&S have gone through the most recent coaching training and approaches. What that means is they can bring structure to the team. Hence they make Stuart look like an utter novice with his disorganised madcap formations and setups.

That is also a weakness because it becomes too rigid and predictable and teams can counter predictability if they themselves are well organised.

What T&S need to do is to learn the balance between structure and freedom. How to be solid but free and create opportunities.

Thing is, they are young and learning on the job. They will make mistake as they learn and an avalanche of keyboard warriors saying we should have 8 up front and going gung-ho isn't going to change their method (because they aren't listening) nor is it the right way to go.

They are trying to work out how to be structured and solid and also score goals and win games with a team they didn't choose and without the right balance to the team.

It's easy to say "we should attack more", it's harder when you're on the touchline, it's your first job and your coaching badges tell you "be structured, keep your shape, pass the ball".

They are slowly transitioning from the world of coaching badges, little red cones and Xbox FIFA into the real world. It will take time and they wi make mistakes.

We need to help them not overly criticise them.

 

Carlisle drew in midweek and lost today but before beating us they hadn’t won in ages

 

Actually I disagree. Performance wise it was very little different to Carlisle, but we managed to stop the shots Oldham had. 20 of them. Oldham controlled this game just as much as Carlisle did last week

 

Yes he didn't look a happy bunny when his number went up and can we blame him, feeding of scraps and some wonder why he comes back to the halfway line at times to get involved in the game it must be very frustrating for the lad.

 

Thats all fair enough. Its why my view, even when we results were strong, is that we should make an initial assessment on T&S in the summer. Because part of that assessment has to be based on whether they show the intent and ability to mould a more effective attacking side and one that's better in possession. Next season I want an all out assault on the Top 3. There are still question marks over T&S, which there were always going to be. Mistakes and opportunities to learn were always going to be evident. The summer is huge for us, we need to be as confident as we can be that they're the real deal.

 

Actually I disagree. Performance wise it was very little different to Carlisle, but we managed to stop the shots Oldham had. 20 of them. Oldham controlled this game just as much as Carlisle did last week

 

Bolton are going to win this league. 9 wins in 10. We should have been on their coat tails

 

I have to agree. And actually, for a spell against Carlisle, we had 15 mins or so second half where we were better than anything we put together today.

 

I don't think I've been over critical, I try and tell it as I see it, I was saying at half time we needed changes and making suggestions that I thought would change the pattern of game https://bantamtalk.com/index.php?threads/home-v-oldham-athletic-3pm-saturday-20th-march.4841/page-10#post-477189, I didn't expect it to change at half time but certainly after 70 minutes we were labouring football wise, I thought T&S subs were pointless Rowe off Cook on, and waited until the 82 minute to make his second sub which again was like for like.
When you have seen a poor display like today and one of the first comments from your manager is it was Important not to lose, I think fans have a right to question that ?.

 

Agree Bronco. I wonder, was that the message in the dressing room before the game? If it was, it's nonsensical. The message should have been, 'if we want to stay in contention for the Play Offs, we have to win this'.

 

We have really missed Cooke. Another 3 points and we are safe. Shame for Cooke as he made us tick.

T&S have maintained that safety is the first step and then maybe change formation to have a late stab at the play offs?

We are looking really solid at the back and didn't really have much to worry about from an industrious Oldham side who also created very little from their possession. Interestingly the stats say that we had a better ratio of shots on target in the game.

Not too worried like others have expressed. We could be Grimsby.

I trust the club to have seen how we have missed that midfield general type in Cooke, and make that a priority for next season. I would keep Sutton but Watt has fallen off a cliff form wise. Terrible ball distribution today.

Fair result today from two teams who can expect to be playing each other again next season.

 

A result today meant nothing either way, a win would keep our play off place bubbling nicely, a draw meant nothing and if we got beat then it should have been a matter of how we got beaten not the fact we got beat, that's how managers learn, as you say I cant believe for one minute that comment about not getting beaten was the message from the dressing room as they entered the pitch, or at least I hope not.
Lets see what Tuesday night brings, there'll be not bitching from me if we get beaten by a better side trying to play football.

 

That’s what frustrates me with this club,we see teams like Bolton (eyeballs of debt)probably go up and our history suggests we stay in the bottom two divisions with a acceptance to it.The attacking display today at home was unacceptable and this should run through the club if we want to get to all of our dreams of promotion.

 

We have decent points tally under T&S , it’s just the McCall era that has done us over. Keep the faith.

 

This is not a pop at T&S but I hope Mark reflects on his opening post match interview comment, not because it made little since with regards our league position but because it's the first time under our new regime being in place that we've heard anything negative.
They made two changes today from the Carlisle starting 11, Rowe for Cook which they have rotated before so no big surprise, and the other being O'Donnell for Hornby, not sure how that is making us better defensively or harder to beat as many have said there is little between our keepers.
Last week there was comments about the weather conditions and the referee, lets get back to what we were doing best playing simple football with players who were comfortable playing in the positions starting again at Glanford Park on Tuesday night.

Carlise11 Oldham 11
Hornby O'Donnell
O'Connor O'Connor
O'Connor O'Connor
Canavan Canavan
Wood Wood
Sutton Sutton
Watt Watt
Vernam Vernam
Evans Evans
Crankshaw Crankshaw
Cook Rowe

 

They're big boys, they can handle a bit of criticism.. If not football mamagement isn't for them.

 

There was today and has been some in some recent games some very poor forward passing. To hit teams and be controlled when conter attacking this a fundamental requirement. Agree the the players in front or to the side must make runs and create space for passes to be played too.

 

I like 4231 as a formation and system, your front 4 need to be flexible and not static however. Our biggest problem is that it’s a possession based formation and we aren’t great in possession, passing it side to side for a bit then lumping it long will get us nowhere fast. That said you also need a plan B and C in football, a saying in boxing is styles make fights so sometimes it just won’t work like today therefore it’s criminal to just make like for like subs and let the game drift to with a draw or narrow defeat. It’d be nice to see a City side that’s proactive rather than reactive for once even if it doesn’t always work. Imran Khan once said I’d rather lose going for a win than play for a draw and a win and a loss is better than two draws.

Now the season is all but dead I’d like to see us give Scales a run in Cooke’s position, we’ve nothing to lose and he can’t do much worse than Evans has there. We should bring FCD back in as well, he’s signed a 4 year deal so there’s no point giving up on him now and these games will be good for the younger players development.

 

UEFA A & B Coaching badges tend to be all about 'transitions' and how you can make the most of the break down in play. Not about 'strict' formations.

But I agree they are learning on the job and I fully appreciate all that, having moved from junior football to coaching womens football in 2019.

But I do think the formation and the substitutions has been very rigid over the last few weeks when I think a little flexibility has been needed. I think today was a prime example. Changing Rowe for Cook had no impact whatsoever - like for like but against 3 big defenders. Change it about, bring Cook on and play 2 against the 3, give them something to think about. I did say to my lad when Rowe went off, watch us get a free kick outside the area with 5 mins to go and who do you want to take it?

I'm surprised Evans was still on the pitch at the end to be honest, a very lethargic performance from him except for the odd run. Left Wood very exposed on the left at times and came inside 'wanting the ball' but had men around him so was never going to get it. Think the last free kick summed him up today...knew he wasn't taking the freekick but just stood there and watched Watt take it....could have moved away to the left trying to draw someone away...

I think Sparks should tell them both...right lads, fantastic job, kept us up, now let's take the handbrake off and just go for it, nowt to lose, you'll learn, the players will learn and we can use it for next year...