Quantcast
  1. Welcome to Bantam Talk

    Why not register for an account?

    Not only can you then get fully involved in the community but you also get fewer ads

  2. Premium Membership now Available


    Please see this thread for more details

    Dismiss Notice

The frightening increase in losses in lower league football continues

Discussion in 'City Talk' started by Jordan, Feb 18, 2026.

  1. Robert Molenaar

    Robert Molenaar Fringe Player

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2018
    Messages:
    469
    Likes Received:
    595
    Port Vale last season -



    No wonder Rupp might want out.
     
    Dennis, Bronco, Jordan and 1 other person like this.
  2. Bronco

    ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2018
    Messages:
    42,817
    Likes Received:
    49,974
    *Edit* No wonder Rupp might want out, more desperately than is being reported.
     
    Jayteebee and Bradford End like this.
  3. SimonW

    Staff Member Admin Moderator ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2018
    Messages:
    7,780
    Likes Received:
    5,467
    Atleast in the Premier League wage reductions are pretty standard for failure to hit certain targets including drops for getting relegated. For example Man Utd players are currently getting 25% less than their agreed salary for failure to make Europe (Would have been a little lower if we had made Europa League or Conference League but still would be less). If as looks likely now they make it to the Champions League next season then it will jump back up. If Spurs go down their players are all on 50% reductions because even with parachute payments owners don't want to be paying the full wages
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
  4. Dennis

    Staff Member Moderator Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2018
    Messages:
    6,672
    Likes Received:
    18,012
    If that is universally applied in the PL, msybe it's the appropriate time to reopen the debate on parachute payments again?
     
    Jordan, NorthernMonkey and Bronco like this.
  5. Bronco

    ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2018
    Messages:
    42,817
    Likes Received:
    49,974
    I cant be100% sure but I believe even back in the day we were in the Premier League Geoffrey Richmond had similar clauses written into players contracts, it makes sense you dont perform and that leads to playing in a lower league players shouldn't be rewarded by receiving the same payments as the did previously.
     
  6. Bradford End

    Bradford End Impact Sub

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2018
    Messages:
    1,019
    Likes Received:
    1,754
    Erm…he doesn’t!
     
  7. SimonW

    Staff Member Admin Moderator ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2018
    Messages:
    7,780
    Likes Received:
    5,467
    It's not Premier League mandated but I believe every club has some form of it in place. I suspect that the likes of Burnley won't have a 50% drop like Spurs have (I believe West Ham are also on a 50% drop) as their players wages are more likely to closer to what a top Championship player would get, in fact Burnley's might even be a two tier system as they will have players who were with them last season and would have got a promotion boost (As these work both Forest and Palace players for example got a boost for getting Europe) but they are most likely on less than an equivalent player they signed this season who would have signed on PL wages but with a bigger wage drop.

    Even if it was though as I've said before we will never get rid of parachute payments without being able to pass some kind of reform of Premier League voting. There are enough clubs who fall in the 'yo-yo' grouping to scupper any vote over Parachute payments, in fact as we keep seeing they hold votes hostage to get them to be increased (for example it got increased when the PL wanted to increase the number of subs. The only way parachute payments could be realistically revisited if something legally binding to outlaw or reduce them was put through outside of the Premier League itself by the Football Regulators and I'm not sure that is something they could push through and you can guarantee the yoyo clubs both currently in the PL and in the Championship would tie that up in the courts.

    It is a shame because I've stated before I think Parachute payments are one of the biggest issues in English football. I would love to see them removed. Like Project Big Picture proposed getting rid of them and putting it into a pot along with an increased solidity payment that was distributed more fairly across all of English football would help massively rather than rewarding yoyo clubs and forcing other clubs to have to overspend to try and break into that group
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
  8. NorthernMonkey

    NorthernMonkey Squad Player

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2018
    Messages:
    13,540
    Likes Received:
    28,071
    50% reduction means very little though if you've a first team squad of 23 players averaging £100,000/£150,000 a week. I bet you still can't avoid huge losses in the championship unless you cut it by at least half again.
     
  9. Kevin1954

    ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    28,318
    Likes Received:
    25,673
    Yes that’s fair and reasonable ….However it doesn’t stop parachute payments which I assume were designed in the first instance, to protect clubs that overspend on ridiculous lengthy and excessive contracts . If it’s not that what’s it for Simon ?
    Hypothetically , if Spurs are relegated , and they have this 50% reduction written into contracts one assumes they will not get a parachute payment because they won’t need one ? I suggest otherwise they will get one , giving them a ridiculously unfair spending advantage over CC clubs in the division. Look at Luton’s spending power two divisions below the Prem?. It’s simple methodology to write “relegation built in contracts” isn’t it ?
    In reality it’s also because they lose broadcasting revenues by not being in the “ honey pot” of the Prem, which undoubtedly is a reward for failure ?

    Thoughts?
     
  10. SimonW

    Staff Member Admin Moderator ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2018
    Messages:
    7,780
    Likes Received:
    5,467
    Yeah the 'smaller clubs' who were more fearful of relegation would often do it on a more ad-hoc basis so one player may negotiate a 10% relegation reduction, another 5% and another 20% but its become more formalised as we have got more formalised post the influx of supposedly wealthy owners post Abramovich and the trouble the majority of those caused when they either didn't have the resources to bank roll losses or they underestimated how much losses were and turned off the tap as that has brought about more financial controls that clubs are worried about breaking especially if they miss Europe or get relegated. Now it's most clubs and its much more formalised although as I mentioned there can be some outliers, for example if Burnley also have a 50% reduction as standard but their promotion uplift was only 25% then a player who got promoted with them last season will lose just that 25% and not the 50% someone who signed this season gets. Ofc the promotion increase might be the same as the relegation reduction
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    Bronco likes this.
  11. Dennis

    Staff Member Moderator Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2018
    Messages:
    6,672
    Likes Received:
    18,012
    Deloittes reported on this a couple of years ago. At the time, their knowledge suggested that in the PL, it was far from universal and even within individual clubs, the practice wasn't applied consistently. To paraphrase them, if clubs want the best, the best would negotiate their own terms in the global football market and they would rarely include provisions to reduce wages. Who really knows whether things have changed much since then.
     
  12. SimonW

    Staff Member Admin Moderator ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2018
    Messages:
    7,780
    Likes Received:
    5,467
    Spurs will still get the Parachute payments even with the wage reduction. It's why we actually see fewer fire sales on relegation than we used to do as with a 50% reduction and parachute payments they have a couple of seasons where keeping the squad intact is more affordable than it used to be (It depends how many are getting payments but they are currently worth between £40-49mill in year 1, £35-40mill in year 2 and £15-18mill in year 3. So by year 3 you certainly need to make cuts but Year 1 you are fairly fine). West Ham for example previously had to break up some good teams for reduced amounts that would have walked right back up but if they go down this season they will only be selling the likes of Bowen because the player wants to go and it won't be lowballed into selling.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    Interested Bystander likes this.
  13. SimonW

    Staff Member Admin Moderator ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2018
    Messages:
    7,780
    Likes Received:
    5,467
    The Average in the premier league is actually lower than that. It's in the £60-80k range and thats Skewed massively by City who pay much more than any other PL club (City Spend around £4.3mill a week, Arenal £3.6mill, Liverpool £3.3mill and United £3.1mill) . Spurs who only spend like 45% of their revenue on wages are said to be around £100k which would take the average down to around £50k. And their biggest earners like Romeo, VdV, Xavi, Gallagher are all likely to push top leave and will have plenty of suitors that will push it even lower. And with parachute payments Spurs won't be held to ransom so will get a decent amount for these players. Burnley's Average is said to only be £28k a week
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
  14. Jordan

    ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2019
    Messages:
    7,188
    Likes Received:
    14,129
    Don't think it's applied everywhere but certainly in the last few years every single club has that protection plan in place now. I was watching some clips of a Rob Green appearance on a podcast this week, he was saying at West Ham they had a 50% reduction in his deal for the drop, but at QPR none of the squad had a reduction clause. So the lads who ended up staying in the champ actually made more money than they did in the PL because their wages and contracts were the same, but they had 8 more league matches in the CH, so they had 8 more apps bonuses, clean sheet or scoring bonuses etc, and then all got a promotion bonus payment off the owners for going up again too. Think Ben Foster said he didn't have a clause either at Watford i think it was (might be wrong). Seems brainless for clubs of that nature to at the time not have a clause in place to protect them from paying daft wages in the CH.

    Kiera Maguire addresses para payments not too long back after being asked a similar question and he said they aren't seen to protect clubs from wages that much anymore, as clubs lose far more in TV and sponsorship deals as well as crowds dropping after a relegation, that makes more of a dent than they would if they paid PL wages in the CH. I'm guessing his thinking was more on the Burnley type clubs pay scale than a Spurs type club, but he made out that clubs see parachutes as something to protect from TV money losses than much else now.
     
  15. Dennis

    Staff Member Moderator Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2018
    Messages:
    6,672
    Likes Received:
    18,012
    I agree with Maguire. The clubs who finish in the relegation zone earned around £100mill just from the Sky/EE domestic broadcasting contracts. That's a huge gap to fill when dropping to the Championship where TV broadcasting is about a tenth of PL levels. Although clubs will clearly want to reduce their wages costs - including selling their in-demand players - parachute payments were originally intended to ease that transition from the PL to the Championship over the following 2 or 3 years. But as we know, thay do distort competition between those in receipt of the payments and the other Championship clubs in a very competitive league.

    Whether parachute payments would ever disappear is highly unlikely. The new IFR has already said he'd want to look at the distribution of broadcasting revenues within the football pyramid. I'd expect that to include challenging the size of the parachute payments rather than questioning the principle of them. Some of the PL clubs have already warned him to steer clear of that!
     
  16. Kevin1954

    ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    28,318
    Likes Received:
    25,673
    Which confirms its compensation for failing on the grass as well as compensating clubs for paying players on long and expensive contacts? Why should the clubs dropping out of the Prem get rewards for failing? It’s insane imho.
     
    CRASS likes this.
  17. Jordan

    ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2019
    Messages:
    7,188
    Likes Received:
    14,129
  18. Jordan

    ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2019
    Messages:
    7,188
    Likes Received:
    14,129
    Found on twitter, this paints the picture a little better.... just over half of the 92 clubs in top 4 divisions in England have published 2024/25 accounts. Only 4 are profitable: Liverpool, Bournemouth, Plymouth Argyle and Peterborough United. Average pre-tax losses: PL £31.1m, Championship £15.1m, League One £5.0m, League Two £2.6m.

    [​IMG]
     
    Kevin1954 likes this.
  19. Kevin1954

    ⚽ P.L.25/26 Entrant Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    28,318
    Likes Received:
    25,673
    Peterborough’s profits are based on player sales alone. From memory Motherville made em just over a million , plus three others and that’s it over the last couple of years .Since then these have largely dried up…crowds can’t in any way sustain them, DMac has clearly said so, even though their catchment area is huge it’s full of grass, sand and pigs. Player sales is their business model. He wants out for a better life in his tax haven?


    PVale sold Tolaj for £1.25 million, in the period just after these accounts ……They must be pouring money down the drain daily as are Gillingham ….. I’d love to know what Huddersfield’s losses are this season. Cripes.
     
    #99 Kevin1954, Mar 27, 2026
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2026
  20. Dennis

    Staff Member Moderator Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2018
    Messages:
    6,672
    Likes Received:
    18,012
    And despite this, some still believe one of two things would happen if we were to be promoted to the Championship this season.

    Firstly, we would somehow do better than just about every other club in the EFL by cutting our cloth accordingly and not running up huge losses every season whilst remaining competitive with other clubs.

    Or secondly, that Rupp would dig deep into his pockets and put millions of his own money into the club to finance the club's losses every year as a favour to the fans.

    Yeah right!
     
    The Wasp, Kevin1954, CRASS and 2 others like this.

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice