Maccabi Tel Aviv FC

Where do people keep getting the idea this is about not being able to protect the Maccabi Tel Aviv fans? It's about the behaviour of Maccabi Tel Aviv fans (and other Israeli Teams fans) over the last couple of season.

For example the situation In Amsterdam last season. From the minute they arrived they were going around waving Israeli flags and chanting both pro-IDF and anti-Palestinian chants. These included things like 'olé, olé, let the IDF win, we will feck the Arabs' and vile chants about there being no children left in Gaza. They also went around ripping down Palestinian flags (even setting some on fire), putting up graffiti that was pro IDF, anti Palestinian and also contained similar vile messages like the chants. They also verbally abused and physically abused a number of people that looked Arab. In the stadium they also decided to make vile chants through a minutes silence for the victims of the Spanish floods.

None of this was reported at the time but when the obvious retaliation came Isreal instantly jumped on the 'antisemitism' train and all the outlets initially all repeated those claims alone. It wasn't until later the agitating from the Maccabi Tel Aviv fans. Fans whose Ultras for the record includes currently serving career IDF Soldiers and there are reports that Mossad has agents embedded in these Ultra groups.

So that's why they are banned, not because they are Jewish but because they have been agitators in incidents that have caused unrest and caused innocent people to be hurt and their property to be damaged. And with the way things are right now its a powder keg that if similar things happen its going to go off in a big way and the polices job is to protect the general public not a bunch of trouble making foreigners

If Villa fans had done what they had done at just that match let alone the other matches it wouldn't have even been a decision the police had to make, UEFA would have banned their fans

 

First of all accusing me of tin-foil hat thinking while you are pushing the Isreali myth that anything they deem against their country is antisemitism is just mental.

And i'm not pretending there isn't hooligans with most teams but the Israeli ones are very specific and problematic group of them at this moment. Their travelling fans (to both home and away as they are having to play home games abroad) are almost exclusively ultra's and Israeli ultras are hard line Zionists. When Tensions are high having a group who agitate those tensions and a government who uses any responce to this agitation to further seed fear in Jews in Europe simply isn't worth it. Neither is putting the general public at risk when we know beyond doubt because thats how they have been at every away game (and their home games too) and what the outcome is almost certainly to be.

Here's a question for you, let's assume European Club football started much earlier. it's 1938 and Union Berlin are playing Villa at Villa Park. It's mainly their Ultra's that attend and they are Nazi's. They had previous of anti-jewish speech, abuse and violence when attending away games. Would you be saying 'Yeah let them attend' even though without doubt are going to agitate things and get a violent response from British Jews?

 

Where did I call you pro-zionist. I said you were pushing a myth because you say

which has the implication that they are being banned because the police are antisemitic rather than because of their repeated actions that agitate and put the wider public at risk.

 

I would add that before the Amsterdam situation happened Besiktas refused to play their home game which was scheduled after the Ajax match because of previous actions by the Tel Aviv fans as they saw it kicking off. It was switched to be played at Tel Aviv's 'home ground' in Hungary but all fans were banned from attending. Other of their 'home' games have had limited capacity thus restricting away fans or away fans outright banned

And we have the current situation where Napoli have banned Frankfurt fans over previous incidents. Where is the fuss over that? It's basically non-existent.

Also Basel fans are often banned when they play French sides due to previous trouble

 

While most Israelis are Jewish, not all Jews are Israeli. They have banned the Tel Aviv fans not Jews (or Arabs who are actual also semites). Villas Jewish fans (or in your suggestion Spurs away fans) are free to attend because they don't pose a serious security issue.

 

You posts are consistently in bad faith. You are so eager to push an agenda using terms you clearly don't even actually understand that you don't even want to actually discuss the subject. And then when this threads been left despite the ban on political posts because sometimes football will have a political factor you then decide to try and derail it by going off on tangent with digs at specific politicians.

So maybe if you don't want posts deleted and the thread left open maybe actually debate in good faith and stay on topic otherwise the mods will just say enough is enough which will be a shame (and imho extremely dangerous)

 

First of all the only thing I accused you of was parroting Zionist lies that the ban was because the threat to the Tel Aviv fans and it was lead by antisemitism. What exactly is wrong about that interpretation, we can all see it with our own eyes.

You decide to effectively call me a crack pot when I detailed the actions in other games, going into detail on the way they agitated the situation and then dismiss it. I even went into further detail of both other situations with them and the strict controls on away fans in their home games. I also highlighted other away fan bans including one the same week as this villa one that doesn't include a Jewish team

When fans are hooligans looking to agitate and cause issues they have to be banned from attending for public safety. And to add it's not like there the problematic ultras are a small minority of those attending. The numbers travelling are fairly small and it's almost exclusively the Ultras.

And again ISREAL AND JUDAISM are not the same. No-one is being banned from attending because they are Jewish. They are being banned for their actions. The fact you seem to want them to come and cause trouble knowing it will cause a reaction resulting in both more division and fear between British Jews and British Muslims (and feeding the white far right) and also causing innocent people injuries, death and priority damage is really worrying. Why would you want that?

 

It should put an end to the whole debate but I fear it won't get enough coverage so there will be pressure for it to be overturned and the Government will basically force the ban to be overturned. If it and the inevitable happens Starmer and co should be arrested and charged with accessory for any crime committed as it will have been totally avoidable