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Everton vs Liverpool

Discussion in 'General Football' started by Frank Castle, Oct 17, 2020 at 2:30 PM.

  1. Frank Castle

    Frank Castle Captain
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    What a cracking game of football that was. :)
     
  2. SimonW

    SimonW Administrator
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    I can't help but think someone random will win the league and a fairly big club may go down. The barely non-existent pre-season (United had about 1 week) seems to be causing some crazy games and I can see teams struggling to name 11 first-team players by the end of the season as with no pre-season and so many games to fit in players are going to be dropping like flies
     
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  3. The Original EB

    The Original EB Impact Sub

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    Spoilt by VAR. They must use magnifying glasses on some offsides.
     
  4. SimonW

    SimonW Administrator
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    I don't get people complaining about VAR offsides. No matter where you take the point you are always going to have this same issue. And if you just leave it to the officials to decide if it was off enough to rule it out you then get inconsistency between decisions and refs. Its about one of the few instances where VAR works really as its one of the few things that have a definitive answer VAR can come to, most other things var covers is opinion
     
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  5. Hoochy-Min

    Hoochy-Min Impact Sub

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    I get what you mean but there is an argument for it going too far. The whole point of the rule is to stop attackers gaining an unfair advantage by standing nearer to the goal than a defender. In the case of this goal the players were around 99% level. The only reason the striker had an advantage was due to the quality of the ball in, nothing to do with his centimetre closer to the line.

    I'd like to see a trail of something similar to the Umpire's Call rule in cricket VAR technology.
     
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  6. Frank Castle

    Frank Castle Captain
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    I agree with you regarding offsides. However, surely VAR should have done something about Pickford's challenge on VVD?
     
  7. Offcomedun

    Offcomedun Regular Starter
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    Anyone see West Ham's stunning comeback against Spurs. 3-0 down after 16 minutes and get the draw. Lanzini wonder strike with the last kick of the game. What a match!
    Good day, eh, @Interested Bystander@Interested Bystander ?
     
  8. Interested Bystander

    Interested Bystander Regular Starter
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    We were robbed mate !
    Never saw it coming TBH
     
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  9. The Original EB

    The Original EB Impact Sub

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  10. Offcomedun

    Offcomedun Regular Starter
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    Good to see big Darren Moore on TV.
     
  11. SimonW

    SimonW Administrator
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    But where do you draw the line over where the advantage is. You can almost always argue that there isn't enough advantage to justify giving offside unless a player is like 10 yards off. And in a sport where at times less than a cm can make a difference, it's hard to say being a cm offside can't make a difference
     
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  12. Hoochy-Min

    Hoochy-Min Impact Sub

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    That's where the 'Umpire's Call' rule would come into play. It allows for a certain margin of play either way.
     
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  13. SimonW

    SimonW Administrator
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    Hadn't it been deemed that play wasn't active? I didn't see the game live just the clip of it so maybe I'm wrong but to get sent off for something that's deemed to happen when the games not active takes certain levels of violent conduct that goes beyond a mistimed tackle
     
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  14. SimonW

    SimonW Administrator
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    But you are then in the realms of inconsistency. You can have a player who is 5 cm's offside and they go with refs decision and in another game (or even the same one) someone given offisde by a cm. The point of VAR is to supposedly remove some of the inconsistency caused by judgement calls but for most VAR decisions it has done that because the nature of the incidents is that they are pure judgement calls, offside is one of the few areas where there is a factual, undeniable correct call and now you are calling for that to go to being more judgement based. Why are we even bothering with VAR and all the time it wastes if its just opinion based
     
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  15. Get Rid Of It

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    Agreed, a complete bottle job by the VAR ref as VVD faces a long lay-off from dangerous play.
    At least the ref Oliver spotted the Richarlison tackle as a straight red otherwise VAR could have gotten that wrong.
     
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  16. Frank Castle

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    It wasn't a mistimed tackle though, it was dangerous play so he should have seen red in my opinion. As you say, it was offside and so play wasn't active, therefore it wasn't a foul/penalty, but when you endanger an opponent like that it's a sending off.
     
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  17. NorthernMonkey

    NorthernMonkey Impact Sub

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    So why was Richarlison sent off then? The whistle had already gone so the play wasn't active either?
     
  18. SimonW

    SimonW Administrator
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    It wasn't like he went out to do damage to VVD intentionally, it was just a clumsy mistimed tackle which makes it serious foul play, not violent conduct.

    Actually, if you watch it the ref doesn't blow until after the second foul as he waits to see if there is an advantage. As such play is deemed to still be active
     
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  19. Edin Nowhere

    Edin Nowhere Fringe Player

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    VAR was a farce in this game.

    Pickford should have been sent off, a tackle round the knee be it clumsy or not is a potential career ending tackle. The fact VAR looked at it suggested that if it was not offside it would be a penalty, because it was offside the penalty wasn't given but the tackle was extremely dangerous.

    As for the offside, if it takes you two minutes to work out if it is or isn't offside on a video feed that is known to have a margin of error then you go with the call on the field.

    In Cricket, Rugby, American Football who have all had TV reviews for far longer than football they go with the decision on the field unless there is clear evidence that the ruling on the field was wrong and there are far less headlines from wrong decisions on that basis.

    VAR is being overused, they are going looking for things and in many ways taking the decisions from the referee and instead of being a Virtual Assistant Referee, the referee on the pitch is the assistant whilst VAR should be renamed VR, Virtual Referee, as it is the guy in the trailer who is actually refereeing the game.
     
  20. SimonW

    SimonW Administrator
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    But that's not the rules of the game. Take away VAR and have the ref flag VVD offside and guess what its no red card

    Why are we even bothering with VAR if we go to the onfield decision in close decisions? It's about the only VAR decision you can get a definitive answer on. Yes there is a margin of error, mainly related to the cameras not being in a high enough framerate to get the exact moment the player making the pass releases the ball but when you get the nearest frame its perfectly accurate (The biggest issue is it's really hard to show on TV, Its something I discussed in one of my Better Than Bowyer video, see video at the bottom which is timestamped to the offside goal where I demonstrate the issue . Where the cameras are causes a false perspective which is why you see people disputing the VAR decisions when they see the lines. Some of the times what seems like borderline on the TV even when the lines are put in in reality is more offside than it seems)

    Yes, it takes too long. Personally, I wish they hadn't even wasted time and money on VAR because again Offsides is one of the few it actually makes a definitive decision on, everything else is an opinion and there are actually better tech for dealing with offsides that are in the works, the real-time player tracking that many top clubs use in training and for post-match analysis, it's not really ready yet for use during a match and the NFL had a few issues when they tested it but as we saw with GLT when the money is there tech leaps forward massively (the tech firms all said the level of accuracy and speed Football wanted for GLT was impossible, they all failed the first test as well but 6 months later multiple companies had their systems working at a level higher than Football demanded) but we have it so why handicap the one area it actually does its job consistently


     
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