COVID-19

I wouldn't rise to it.

In an earlier post he pretty much admitted that there is alterior motives to his posting, ie trying to make anyone that didnt vote the way he wanted in the election feel guilt.

Anyone that thanks the nhs staff, whoever they voted for should clap them for their efforts. They are brave people and deserve our respect.

 

No drivel. My points have been around.

We lack PPE!
We lack testing
We need to up our testing
Mostly over 70's will die from this.
Other countries are coping better
The economy is on its knees
Lockdown won't last forever
We need to be able to go back to work ASAP
Hancock is a prick
Conservatives using situation to score points
Many will die from this
NHS been neglected for years
Government need an to let us know an exit plan

Which bit do you disagree with?

 

Ok - firstly your main posts were about the economic impacts, economy. So you either open things up, save the economy, and forgo the death rates that will be high, or you try and strike a balance, which is what I see being done.

The ppe stuff come well after that. Although agree, it's a bad situation. Us and every other country was caught unprepared for this.

Conservatives point scoring- leave the politics out of it... it's not needed at this point in time.

Why do you need to know the exit plan? Your just jumping on the bandwagon that is orchestrated by the media. We are well away from an exit plan. Trust those who make the decisions to make the decisions. Why is it important that you know now... it's a long way off.

 

How are other countries coping better?

You have no luck the current situation when it comes it PPE, there's a thread on Twitter that explains the current supply issues with PPE. Go find it and read it!

Political point scoring? It's not anything new is it? Have you missed every general election since you were born? Every party is guilty of it, not sure how they've been point scoring though.

Name me a country that has an exit plan that is at the same stage of epidemic as us? Also explain what a Fordy exit plan entails?

 

Lastone on the tangent and back to the virus, your right about vocational schools too. Not everyone is academic, not everyone is good in an office environment (I would regard myself as academic and a smart cookie but I fecking hate offices. gimme a factory floor or working freelance anyday). We as a society need to massively rebalance what is considered to be worthwhile employment, hoepfully that can be something positive we take from this crisis.


Yeah on reflection, our political system as a whole should shoulder the blame. New Labour were the ones that really put rocket boosters onto this way of thinking, aided and abetted by 10 years of the tories who have a fetish for free market deregulation and now we have a university system that delivers poor outcomes for all those involved except university balance sheets. I think as above society needs to change and stop this disdain and contempt for anything that can't be quantified onto a spreadsheet of some description.

 

Germany?

 

Sorry but the economy needs saving. Don't know how old you're but anyone under 50 will suffer big time from this and those who have kids around 17 plus will suffer as well. Yes, nobody wants anyone to die but 16 million unemployed in America and about 9m on Furlough here it's going to take some recover mission.

Conservatives point scoring - yeah tell that to the conservatives trying to score points. Damn Boris even thinking he's Jesus Christ today.

Exit plan - I want to know an exit plan so we can all have something to aim for an businesses can start planning. No exit plan and businesses will get scared and start thinking about sacking people or redundancies.

Oh and I don't copy anyone! I tell it how it is!

 

Germany, Denmark. Australia, South Korea

Germany have tested around 1.3m us 325k

Germany/ Denmark plan to send kids back to school

Look, if you want to wave the British flag and think we are doing well from this then do it but in my eyes we are struggling!

On route to have the most deaths in Europe and acting like a 3rd world country. You want to be proud to be British but can't handle the truth.. hmmm getting us far that!

 

I'm 30, and brought a house in the last 12 months as a first time buyer. Trust me, its worrying times all round.

What I am saying is, you are pointing out all the issues, and yet it would seem you would also oppose any solution.

For example... we all get to go back to work next week. This puts extra pressure on the nhs, and ppe required to run it.

1 thing has to take priority over the other. Or you strike a balance, which is what I believe is being done?

 

kinky, m8

 

We are on track to have the highest fatality rate in Europe, and I suspect when this is done it'll be us America and Brazil with the worst performances. Other countries have dealt with this better by allowing less people to die from it. That to me is incredibly straight forward. Germany, South Korea, Taiwan, even China once they stopped lying about the scale of the issue have easily outstripped our response. This is through a combination of not being complacent, effective testing and contact tracing and ensuring a properly managed and funded health service so they can cope with any cases that do occur. We did none of this, pissed about wasting time talking about herd immunity when we still had a chance to eliminate this thing early on and now we've got 10k deaths when we aren't even getting close to the peak of the outbreak.

A flu pandemic has also been the top of the UK govts risk register since New Labour (Alan Johnson came out and said this recently), so for them to say this is a surprise and that nothing more can be done is an outright lie of the highest order. We have known a threat like this has been highly likely since New Labour got in which is something like 20 odd years. How much longer do you want to give them to prepare?

With regard to an exit plan, it would be foolish not to at least look at an exit strategy now, given we've just learnt a very fatal lesson about the importance of forward planning and not ignoring things in the hope they'll just go away. I would like to see decisions on in what order the lockdown will be lifted and in what order people will be able to return to work. Those are not massively difficult things to plan for given the information and resources the govt has available, provided a bit of joined up thinking is employed. They've just created a whole new system for paying the self employed in something like a week and a half and your saying we can't plan an exit strategy?

 

I said last week that's we are suffering because of 2 things. 1) we ignored the Virus in Jan/Feb and 2) we failed to prepare.

The lockdown is to give the world time to build more hospitals and get their act together. They is no vaccine.

If we don't get the economy up and running the new house you brought will lose about10~ 20% on value in the next 12 months.

I said from the start if we are to do the lockdown for 3 week so we need to do it correctly but we do it at around 50% then you have Hancock holding face to face meetings and parliament reopening on the 21st.

The lockdown is a joke in the Uk. We might as well all work ASAP because they is no vaccine but the reason I said middle of May we will return is because the lockdown is a world lockdown and other countries have extended it until the end of the month and I see we will follow but the government is playing games trying to make out they're not a 3rd world country and in control of the situation.

I get your point about pressure on the NHS and PPE but it's all about testing. If Hancock gets to his 100k target then they should be less pressure the NHS because as Boris said to get out of this it's all about testing, testing and testing. Germany and others have been massive on testing but the UK have failed so in this department hence why deaths and cases are so bad!

 

The house is a longer term investment. If we loose 15% in the short term, we will make it back in the longer. There has been a lot of suppression in the market due to brexit - that's another subject

As you say testing is key. There is no point in finger pointing on this, as i dont believe any other government would have acted any differently, it's the shit situation we find ourselves in. As with anything to do with business or politics.... it's not about the feck up that's taken place, its done, it's about the recovery to get out of it.

Get testing sorted, get hospital numbers down, then start releasing the exit strategy. The thing that annoys me with the exit strategy, is we will not know we have hit the peak till 1-2 weeks after it has passed, so we could still be 3-4 weeks away from confirming that.... then think about lifting certain restrictions.

 

We could be in peak now because if not then we are in for some scary numbers. I see the curve flattering already and we have been in lockdown for nearly 3 weeks plus with parliament on the 21st still going head it highlights to me the peak is now.

As I say it's a worldwide lockdown and we haven't the testing so the lockdown will continue for 2 -3 weeks.

The government will have an exit plan but don't want to rattle people at this moment.

Scientists can't lead.

 

We may be. But we wont know until numbers come down, and most importantly stay down.

Exit too early, and the impact could be catastrophic.

3-4 extra weeks - maybe longer is not a massive impact to me, if it saves peoples loved ones. We all have to pay the price for this. Both physically in the short term, and financially in the longer term. It's not great, but it's what we face

 

Bit of a tengent really and not sure what you're answering from the post you quoted?

I raised 3 points... PPE supply, it's a fact that if a government intervenes in the manufacturing of the PP and we don't have a supply base for it we aren't going to be the top of the list. We aren't the only country in same boat. I aren't sure of the accuracy, but even still the article below suggests that everyone's shining light in Germany haven't got everything right!
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.spiegel.de/international/germany/germany-is-failing-in-its-efforts-to-obtain-protective-gear-a-fd08b86c-7b3a-4ac2-b2fe-089f4490679c-amp

There may be well some exit strategy planning, but logic would suggest it would be stupidty to release it to the public and promote a false dawn, people have struggled to follow social distancing! After all, it looks like the super perfect EU are holding back any exit stratergies for this exact reason!

https://euobserver.com/coronavirus/148024

I think you are being super premature in wanting to know what order people will go back to work - do you think that is right at the top of goverment planning? With all the work and planning that needs to go into the NHS right now I hope it isn't.

 

Excuse me but I think I've made some very valid points as well as highlighting hypocrisy.

By all means clap the NHS staff everyone, not that that does one thing to help. They've been keeping on, keeping on for years without our applause. They do it because they care, not for applause. I think it's great that people are valuing the people that keep society moving but it's tinged with an air of sadness on my part. They've been doing it for years, emptying your bins, stacking your shelves and picking and packing your food for minimum wage. You Tory voters are only too happy to keep them down. Your likes of Idlebantam saying 'well they had just as much opportunity to succeed in life as I did, they didn't work hard enough to make it happen.'

You've got people there literally keeping your life moving smoothly during the greatest upheaval to society since WW2 and you want to patronisingly clap the key workers one minute and the next time you vote you'll vote for the party that will keep them on zero hours contracts and universal credit.

The hypocrisy, stinks.

 

9m plus on Furlough. If we don't realise an exit plan soon then many of them will lose their jobs.

Many Self employed companies will go out of business.

People/businesses need to plan and they need hope. Many businesses have no income coming in and will start to get scared.

I just think that if parliament is restarting on the 21st the an exit plan has to be delivered by then no matter what the science is saying. Politicians go back to work but hardly anyone else can? Not having that!

 

I keep seeing people saying we are tracking to have the worst fatality rate in Europe but have never caught where this has come from except for one that suggested we would have about 66k deaths on the graph but when I actually read the report it said it had picked that number as it was somewhere in the middle of the range that they had predicted of between 14k and 220k. They also said when they did the review last week it had too little data to predict successfully with an accuracy