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Most liked posts in thread: Premier League and EFL reform [UPDATE 3 Dec 2020: Rescue Package Agreed]

  1. SimonW

    SimonW Administrator
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    That's not totally true though. Chelsea and City didn't used to be in that group of the 'powerhouse teams' while the likes of Leeds, Blackburn and Villa were. It does evolve and teams can both fall out of it and also get into that group.
     
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  2. JonButterfield

    JonButterfield Star Player
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    I imagine the English League would have huge potential if there ever was a European league.

    The cost of games, particularly away games, would be astronomical. The only fans would be long time fans or wealthy people.

    The English League should be able to entice English fans back to the real clubs with history.
     
  3. Steve1970

    Steve1970 Squad Player
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    Best idea is say yes to what ever premier league want but they can't enter fa cup or league Cup see how that sits with the overpaid prima Donna's
     
  4. Fordy117

    Fordy117 Just call me Mr Flip-Flop!
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    Do you see Rupp and the other EFL owners of clubs wanting to put 2-3 million in a pot to get the 250m + that they want from the PL?

    No!so get back in your hole.
     
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  5. SimonW

    SimonW Administrator
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    Again though it largely comes from Europe. The English clubs are often fine with it being discussed as its a good negotiating tool without them having to do anything. But if we have a quick look at the current Domestic rights deals

    League Value Tiers covered
    English Premier League £1.665b 1
    French Ligue 1 £1.038b 1 & 2
    German Bundesliga £1.030b 1 & 2
    Spanish La Liga £1.010bn 1 & 2
    Italian Serie A £862m 1
    Turkish Süper Lig £393m 1
    Brazilian Campeonato Série A £250m 1
    English Football League £119m 2-4
    Portuguese Primeira Liga £110m 1
    Belgium A/B & Womens division £93m 1-2 + W
    US MLS £71m 1
    Dutch Eredivisie £67m 1


    And that's just the top 12. There are a bunch of European countries not yet listed who would have teams in it who get very little. The fact the EFL gets more than alot of the top European leagues tells alot, as does the fact that their value is about 1/10th of some of the biggest leagues in the world such as Spain, Germany, France and Italy

    As we also show less domestic games its even better for English teams on a per match basis

    Rank League Country UEFA Rank Number of Live Games Value Per Game
    1. Premier League England 2nd 200 £8.75m
    2. Bundesliga Germany 4th 306 £3.36m (€3.86m)
    3. Ligue 1 France 5th 380 £2.68m (€3.075m)
    4. Serie A Italy 3rd 380 £2.27m (€2.61m)
    5. LigaBBVA Spain 1st 380 £1.94m (€2.23m)
    6. Süper Lig Turkey 11th 306 £1.28m (₺11.05m)
    7. Football League England N/A 168 £708k
    8. Ladbrokes Premiership Scotland 14th 54 £595k
    9. Liga NOS Portugal 7th 306 £360k (€413k (est.)
    10. Jupiler League Belgium 9th 240 £280k (€321k)


    The EFL jumps up 1 place and is significantly closer on a per match basis to these top leagues (Scotland gets an even better bump mind you)

    They see the money in England and see the super league as a way of getting the same kind of money. The English clubs really wouldn't see the same kind of benefit
     
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    #36 SimonW, Oct 11, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2020
  6. Dennis

    Dennis Captain
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    I'm well aware of the which clubs have been powerhouse teams of the past. That's irrelevant to the current proposal. One of the purposes of the Man U/Liverpool proposal is to bake in the current Big 6 and remove the likelihood of any new clubs joining the inner circle and one or more being expelled. What has happened in the past has little relevance moving forward. The investment which the Big 6 have already made in say the past decade to reach that position is, in the owners minds, sufficient justification to hard bake the current Big 6. Whether that's the right thing to do I suspect depends on where owners realistically expect their clubs to be in future years.

    It's of no importance to me personally because I have little interest in the PL. But it will be of immense importance to clubs outside of the current Big 6 who will be effectively excluded from joining that group. We'll have to wait and see whether the PL and the the other PL clubs buy into the current Liverpool/Man U proposal or whether it's simply an opening gambit.
     
  7. JonButterfield

    JonButterfield Star Player
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    For sure, and that's interesting. I'm not disputing who wants it most it why, in just saying if it did happen it should work out well for those English teams not involved.
     
  8. Fordy117

    Fordy117 Just call me Mr Flip-Flop!
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    You seriously need to open your eyes and think. It's not just about the PL:

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2020/oct/11/plan-to-mend-the-great-crack-in-football-pyramid-should-not-be-swept-off-the-table

    Nicking Dan Kennett's point that the offer being put forward would average out to £8m+ for each other club down the other divisions. This is what they get currently (again via Dan Kennett):

    [​IMG]
     
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  9. Dennis

    Dennis Captain
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    That's what EFL clubs currently receive in solidarity payments from the Sky/PL TV contract. EFL clubs also receive almost as much again from the quite separate EFL TV broadcasting contract. The Liverpool/Man U proposal wants the PL to have exclusive rights over the broadcasting of all football games including the EFL's and to share that on some basis with the EFL. If that happens then the current solidarity payment (including whatever distribution of the PL's TV contract is agreed) from the PL would need to more or less double to make sure EFL clubs weren't worse off. And realistically, that would mean rmoving the parachute payment regime as David Conn suggest. The big losers in that will be the former PL clubs who receive parachute payments with the winners being the rest of the EFL clubs. As much as I'd like to see more money going into the EFL, I cannot imagine why the majority of the PL clubs would vote for that since some of them would inevitably lose out.
     
  10. Super bantams

    Super bantams Squad Player

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    This is not a good idea.

    League Cup axed and also with Premiership reduced to 18 teams means 2 teams will be thrown out of the league due to restructuring.

    Premiership are only making proposals that benefit them and nobody else.
     
  11. Super bantams

    Super bantams Squad Player

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    No it doesn't all other leagues numbers are unchanged. So 2 teams will be relegated into non league
     
  12. JonButterfield

    JonButterfield Star Player
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    Let's nominate teams, it'll be fairer.
     
  13. SimonW

    SimonW Administrator
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    The thing is though the smaller Premier League teams have been holding English Football to ransom for years now. As I've already mentioned the plan for the Premier League was always to reduce down to 18 teams. When it came to ratifying reductions the smaller teams dug their heals in, just getting down to 20 saw the ridiculous parachute payment setup which just helps create yoyo clubs and then situations where those who have real issues and even drop out of the Championship to have vast amounts coming in that the others can't compete with.

    Getting back to the original plan and distributing the money that goes to the EFL in a fairer way is a positive for all but the clubs that basically abuse the parachute payment situation
     
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  14. Bronco

    Bronco Star Player
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    It will be interesting to see how the monies given to Leagues 1/2 are ring fence, who will make the rules that it can only be spent on.
    We've seen in the past owners screwing clubs, what would stop an owner playing lip service to the EFL and pocketing most of the money ?.
     
  15. The Original EB

    The Original EB Squad Player

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  16. How

    How Knows Football
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    Trying his best to look after Liverpool. Get rid of him
    He sounds like @Fordy117@Fordy117
     
  17. Fordy117

    Fordy117 Just call me Mr Flip-Flop!
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    Look, like @Dennis@Dennis has pointed out this is just a proposal and it might mean back to the drawing but one thing is now clear 250m to the EFL will not just be handed over!

    Man City last week mentioned that they said the football league format is a shambles, doesn't work and suggested under PL under 23 teams to join it.

    Rochdale chairman on Sky has said thinks he will back it as it means getting the money in now.

    Liverpool and Man Utd have basically started the ball rolling. They already have the backing of Spurs and West Ham. It's 9 teams not 6 that will control things. Changes to the EFL will happen! It's a matter of time.

    How can Bradford City owned by Rupp have no assets? It's a joke mate.
     
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  18. SimonW

    SimonW Administrator
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    It's not though. Again as I keep saying we have a small group of clubs who basically spend a lot of time yoyoing who have been controlling English football for only this small group benefit. They hinder English clubs chances in Europe, they hinder the national team and they hinder 99% of the EFL. These clubs benefit massively from the current setup, they get promoted, get a massive payday, don't generally invest, go down with massive parachute payments which then gives them a massive chance of coming back up within the next few seasons and the cycle repeating. The Parachute payments mean even if a club implodes as we have seen with Sunderland they don't even have to take their situation seriously and that until the wage cap (although they get away with ignoring it as they had many of their players on long contracts so they don't get included fully) it meant they had an advantage and that pushed everyone else into overspending.

    The parachute payments only exist because the way the voting worked the original plan of the PL couldn't go through without giving them that and it's massively unfair on the rest of the EFL. Teams shouldn't be being run with the sole intention of trying to hold on while banking the large riches and then still banking the riches when they go down. They should be wanting to actually try and improve and win things but it doesn't make sense in the current setup. Sure this does see a move to give 8 clubs who have proven long-term PL pedigree (and then Man City) more power but it also makes the whole setup and the distribution of money much fairer. There will be less need for clubs to look to get into this cycle as it will be a smoother transition moneywise and you will see a fairer more competitive setup across the board.

    To highlight the way these 'yoyo' clubs have been looking after themselves look at the whole PPV thing. By all accounts, there were two groups, 8 headed by Ed Woodward who wanted it to be between £5-10 and free access to season ticket holders, and then 12 'smaller' clubs who were calling for north of £15 and no free access to ST holders. No side had the votes to get what they wanted and it ended up with the smaller clubs looking for the biggest cash grab ended up winning out as all the Premier League clubs needed to replace some of the matchday income they are losing (and the threat of the TV money that may be held back) so that's how we got what we did
     
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  19. Onside87

    Onside87 Impact Sub

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    Sounds like Rupp is going to have to put his hand in his pocket to just keep us afloat. Let's hope his heart is in it.
     
  20. SimonW

    SimonW Administrator
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    If you read the proposal part of it is about removing that massive cliff that clubs fall off when they drop out of the PL that makes the parachute payments necessary. Even with Parachute payments the EFL currently gets 7% of the PL's income and most of that goes to the clubs that are receiving the parachute payments. Under the proposals, 25% of the PL income will find its way to the EFL. In addition, bundling the TV rights together should significantly increase the value of the EFL rights bringing in even more money.

    On West Brom it's good that they are investing in their training setup. As I've said I would have actually liked the infrastructure part of this to include the coaching and medical/sports science side and not just the grounds as especially in League 1 and 2 that's an area that's really lacking but it's not really showing any Ambition by West Brom to do anything but keep yoyoing. Their squad investment has a real feel of 'We will be back in the Championship next year so here are players that either will do a great job there or we will almost certainly be able to sell on for significantly more'. The best they could hope for was copying Sheffield United and hope they have a style that catches people out and gets them a second season but as we are seeing from Sheffield at the end of last season and now this season when teams learn to deal with them they haven't invested in enough PL quality players to keep it up and look like its going to be a real battle for them to stay out of the relegation fight. Them and Fulham were favourites to go down as soon as they got promoted and their business hasn't changed that, unlike Leeds who seem like they have invested with the view of staying in the PL for the long run
     
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