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COVID-19

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by king karl, Feb 15, 2020.

  1. Dennis

    Dennis Captain
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    It would be good to properly understand why police officers are being told not to download the Covid app to their personal phones. Are there security issues for those who have already downloaded the app?

    I wonder if there are any other groups who don't need to do it either? Maybe Govt special advisers? Or Govt ministers and MPs? ;)

    More seriously, examples such as this do little to engender trust in how the Govt is handling track & trace. And that appears to be a fundamantal part of dealing with the virus in the period prior to there being a vaccine available to all. It's another avoidable shot in the Govt's foot.
     
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  2. Offcomedun

    Offcomedun Important Player
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    Sorry, can't find a way to get my reply out of the quote box. Tried cutting and pasting but it doesn't seem to work. I've re-posted below, instead, so it's more readable.
     
    #7102 Offcomedun, Sep 29, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2020
  3. Aaron Baker

    Aaron Baker Impact Sub

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    It's the other way isn't it? They can download it on their personal phones but not their work phones?

    I assumed it was because they're pretty much guaranteed to be in constant contact with people who have had a positive test while they're enforcing the rules so would be in perpetual isolation but maybe that's too simplistic?
     
    Dennis likes this.
  4. Offcomedun

    Offcomedun Important Player
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    @Aaron Baker@Aaron Baker Are you seriously suggesting that the majority of our entertainment and hospitality industries should just be allowed to die? Because that's the logical corollary of what you are suggesting. These things aren't 'obsolete', they are simply struggling to stay in existence during a period of unprecedented, but temporary, disruption. When the pandemic ends, in one, two years - who knows exactly, but it will end eventually - do you want to be living in a country with no pubs or bars, no clubs, no local music venues, no theatres, pantomimes, musicals, classical concerts, operas, music festivals etc etc?

    This country is world renowned for its entertainment industry, which brings in billions in tourism and is one of the major leisure activities of the population. If all the venues and promotors go out of business because they are seen as 'obsolete' then future life will be grim indeed'.

    It's essential that more be done to support venues to keep them afloat and more done to support musicians, singers, jobbing actors, dancers etc and all the workers and venues that support them. The government seems to have completely overlooked the entertainment sector in its support measures. Huge numbers in this industry are self employed and have seen their source of income drop straight off a cliff in March. If allowed to die it will take years, if not decades, to rebuild this industry, which is essential to the social life and mental health of the general populatio[/QUOTE]
     
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  5. Aaron Baker

    Aaron Baker Impact Sub

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    Well, yes, if the disruption isn't in fact temporary but is actually permanent, or semi permanent then yes.

    Nobody wants to be living in a country without them but that isn't the discussion. It's about whether it should be expected to prop them up in the mean time. Maybe the government could find all the people who were manufacturing Betamax back in the day and keep funding their businesses? Things change and it's not the government's responsibility to fill that gap when they do,

    When the pandemic is over - whenever that is - the entertainment industry will come back but in the mean time there is a limit to how long we should expect the government to fund that over and above the usual unemployment payments. In the short terms that industry doesn't exist in the same way that it did a year ago.,
     
  6. Dennis

    Dennis Captain
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    In fairness, the Govt announced a £1.6bn bailout nearly 3 months ago for the 'cultural' sector which includes many of the things you've identified - music venues, local theatres, concert halls and so on. Unfortunately only a small amount of that (<£3mill) has so far got to the front line (mainly small music venues) because the various arts bodies who have been given the responsibility for co-ordinating and distributing the funds haven't yet agreed on how best to distribute for maximum effect! There seems to be too many fingers in the pie.
     
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  7. Offcomedun

    Offcomedun Important Player
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    No surprise there.
    It must be desperate times for all the individual jobbing musicians etc, whose main source of income - live gigs/shows - has completely dried up.
     
  8. Faithful Bantam

    Faithful Bantam Squad Player

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    But on the plus side, they’ll be protected from a disease that they have practically zero chance of dying from.
     
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  9. Dennis

    Dennis Captain
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    I heard Lloyd-Webber discussing it a couple of months ago and making a special case for Govt financial support for some of the main west end theatres. He was asked why people like him who have made a serious fortune from cultural events shouldn't be digging into their own pockets rather than expecting taxpayers to subsidise it. He was on the back foot at that point. I didn't know at that time that he just happened to own 7 of the major west end venues including the Palladium and the Theatre Royal! I suspect it's these powerful and influential voices within the cultural sector who are wanting more than their fair share who are holding things up for smaller venues, jobbing actors and so on.

    You can too readily see the parallels with current discussions in the football sector!
     
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  10. Tony Wilkinson

    Tony Wilkinson Squad Player
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    Most folk throughout their lives across all sectors spend more than they earn, example top of the range cars ,foreign holidays etc, absolutely fine IF you can afford it, but they disregard the possibility of being out of work for any length of time and not realising that this also is the way it is when your working life comes to an end...
    Basic economics should be taught in schools and folk being made aware that putting a few quid away for hard times perhaps is a good idea rather than relying on someone else (taxpayer) to pick up the bill...
     
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  11. YungNath

    YungNath Impact Sub

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    Given the only companies that are surviving okay are massive corporations I think thats more than a bit unfair
     
  12. Edin Nowhere

    Edin Nowhere Impact Sub
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    So today we have had a minister on the Radio this morning not knowing the new restrictions in the North East. We have council leaders saying there were discussion had regarding potential new measure but no one knew that they would be announced without prior notice in the house of commons yesterday.

    We then have Boris who "mis-spoke" today when asked about the new regulations.

    This is what happens when laws are passed in backroom without proper scrutiny.

    Follow the science! Well the science says that those most likely to die are either elderly or have underlying health issues but it would be wrong to lock them away. Well whats right locking everyone away instead except for when they have to go to school or work?

    It appears there are at least 50 backbench Tory MPs who are willing to confront this law making behind closed doors, with examples of a 10pm curfew and children being included in the rule of six as two example of rules that required far more scrutiny than being passed. Lets be honest this rule of six is a complete joke. Since it was annoucned barely a few weeks ago many areas have had a whole host of regulations dumped on top, why they still persist with it when the curfew, mixing in homes etc have all be added on top means it's not fit for purpose. Surely if you are meeting people outside it is in a safe environment as thats what the science shows but no the rule applies the same inside and out, except now in some places it is illegal to meet people inside.

    I have been supportive of action being required to control the virus, but since July it's all just been made up as they go along. Rules plucked out of a bingo machine and due to a bill passed in March put into law without question.

    There are idiots out there calling for full lockdowns but the damage being done now is not a handful of deaths from CoVid, it's people's livilhoods being trashed, jobs being lost, people living in isolation, mental health issues and people facing uncertain futures.

    I only hope that this madness of laws without scrutiny is wrestled back from the cabinet who are doing a good job of acting like the USSR.
     
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  13. Dennis

    Dennis Captain
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    It's the role of Parliament going back nearly 400 years to the civil war to question and scrutinise the executive whether that's the king or the Govt of the day or an individual minister or even Prime Minister. It's banana republics which try and bypass their Parliaments or even try and suspend them from sitting and we're not yet a banana republic. But eventually in a democracy, the penny drops. Parliament is sovereign even when it doesn't suit the Government!

    Even at a time of crisis, Parliament shouldn't simply be ignored.
     
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  14. RCarol

    RCarol Squad Player
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    [/QUOTE]
    Love this post!
     
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  15. trevor

    trevor Squad Player
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    The question is how far you destroy society to save it
     
  16. Craven Cottager

    Craven Cottager Squad Player

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    Yet another gaff today by Bozo the Clown who needs to be told that careless talk costs lives.
     
  17. Aleman

    Aleman Fringe Player

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    The economic damage and disruption to health services is killing and will kill more than the virus has done recently. Excess deaths at home were around 700 in the latest week. People that should be going to hospital are not getting there. Also, deaths from flus and pneumonias are still considerably ahead of Covid. Parliament needs to start asking questions. Boris seems to be killing more than he is saving - and taking account of economic damage effects in the future, probably a lot more.

    https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsregisteredweeklyinenglandandwalesprovisional/weekending18september2020



    Over 7000 new cases by date of report in the UK today - BUT ...

    The trend by date of sampling still shows a slowing rise and a SE/NW split.

    FAR MORE IMPORTANTLY, English hospital admissions look to be flattening out and the last 4 days are all down. Wales and Northern Ireland have no clear recent trend, i.e. flattish. Scotland is clearly accelerating from a low base. Only Scotland seems to be following the new case trend.

    Cases in Northern Ireland have gone from 10 to 200 per day in 2 months. Deaths gone from a 7-day average of 0 to just over 1 and back to 0.1. What's going on? Scotland cases went from 22 to 480 in 2 months. Deaths from 0 to just over 1 and back to 0.4 per day. Wales is up a little to just over 1 per day. These are all very low numbers compared to wave 1 and to other causes of deaths. England is under 30 per day and looks to have stopped rising in the last few days after September's rise. It's still fairly low in the scheme of things.

    Hospitalisations and death trends don't seem to bear much resemblance to new cases recently.
     
    #7117 Aleman, Sep 29, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2020
  18. Aaron Baker

    Aaron Baker Impact Sub

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    I said at the time when you posted this that I'd wait for a week before drawing conclusions to make sure we weren't underestimating the effect of the lag.

    How many of those 5 peaks are still accurate? This is why we shouldn't put too much weight on recent data. We have to wait just a little while for things to become clearer.
     
  19. Offcomedun

    Offcomedun Important Player
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  20. Edin Nowhere

    Edin Nowhere Impact Sub
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    Because we have a clown puppet running the country with Cummings pulling the strings?
     
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