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Brexit

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by Park bantam, Jun 14, 2018.

  1. Bronco

    Bronco Star Player
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    The DUP leader has stated anything with regards the back stop is unaceptable,
    If that remains the case, Boris would as the MP says throw Northern Ireland under the bus to get a deal.
    If Northern Ireland were like Scotland demanding a referendum for Northern Ireland to be an independent country I think that may be a starting point but as they aren't, throwing them under the bus would IMO be an outrageous thing to do, and yes I still want out of the EU but not at the cost of part of our UK being broken up.
    Didn't the EU say if the UK left without a deal they would not enforce a hard boarder between Northern & Southern Ireland.
     
  2. trevor

    trevor Squad Player
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    I think a commitment in any agreement to conclude a free trade deal with all speed so that any arrangement would be temporary may well tempt the DUP to back such a deal, Whether our own MPs would is a different matter with the LDs and SNP stating openly they are for remain only and the Labour party on the brink of declaring the same,
    On a separate note the Tories should now announce there will be no election until the fixed term is up on the basis that parliament has voted twice against an early one,
     
    Tony Wilkinson likes this.
  3. Offcomedun

    Offcomedun Important Player
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    Really?
    How would they govern until 2022 with a majority of -1, not counting the twenty odd that they've booted out?
    Once the 31st October has come and gone, regardless of whether an EU extension occurs, Corbyn will propose a vote of No Confidence which the government will lose. Corbyn won't be able to form a government because the Libs and SNP won't back him, so an Autumn GE is inevitable.
     
  4. Bronco

    Bronco Star Player
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    If we can't get out of the EU that's the next best option, sad times for democracy.
     
  5. trevor

    trevor Squad Player
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    It is a strange one but imagine this scenario, The government lose a vote of confidence, The Government proposes a General election because of it, It needs two thirds majority and the Government itself votes against it so it cannot go through so the existing Government stay in power, The 14 day rule only comes in if a Prime minister resigns but if he proposes an election instead and then wins it he will stay in power?
    Am sure there are holes in that but is just a thought in this strange new world
     
  6. Offcomedun

    Offcomedun Important Player
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    I'm not sure if it works like that.
    If the government wants to call an election before the fixed term ends they have to get two thirds of the house to agree to it.
    But I think it's different if the government loses a No Confidence vote. In that case the opposition is given 14 days to try to form a government that can command the confidence of the house. If they can't do that then a GE follows automatically, I think.
     
  7. Offcomedun

    Offcomedun Important Player
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    Whether or not we leave the EU on 31st October a GE will be necessary because the government can't get anything through the Commons and Labour wouldn't be able to form a government as things stand. So a GE is the only way to get a viable government that could pass any legislation through Parliament.
     
  8. Dionysus

    Dionysus Fringe Player

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    Not quite how it works. If a government loses a vote of confidence, then that automatically triggers a 14 day period where any group of MPs may attempt to command the confidence of the house. There’s no resignation of a PM required.

    The Fixed Term Parliament Act route to an election requires a two thirds supermajority, but this is a separate process. Both of them are different means to the same outcome, but operate in isolation. In practice, a government would no longer have the power to table an election under the FTPA route once it has lost the confidence of the house.

    I think once we get here though, are we in danger of maybe overthinking this?
     
  9. Dionysus

    Dionysus Fringe Player

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    They wouldn’t, there is no path out of this short of mass Damascene conversions of MPs that doesn’t go through a General Election.
     
  10. Dionysus

    Dionysus Fringe Player

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    This doesn’t really touch on what I said.

    You’re partially right, no board room in the country would operate in the same way. But the House of Commons isn’t anything like a boardroom, it’s literally a debating chamber. It’s one of two legislative chambers in the country and we there isn’t really a parallel.

    A minority of MPs are reprehensible and treat politics as a career game. But the majority of MPs are acting in the interest of the party to improve the country in the way they see fit, and some of them are doing brilliant things for their constituents to make a difference. We do those MPs a massive disservice by tarring the whole thing with the same brush.
     
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  11. Dionysus

    Dionysus Fringe Player

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    The Labour position is becoming slowly more clear. In essence along the lines of second referendum between remain and a credible leave option (along the lines of a NI only backstop according to McDonnell). This makes sense as an election strategy I think. Revocation without a referendum would be palpably undemocratic, in my opinion. But for the Lib Dems who have to fight tooth and nail for any media coverage without a hope of a majority, this makes sense for them to nail their “bollocks to Brexit” credentials to the wall.

    Tom Watson has tonight though come out with a ‘we must have a referendum before an election’ line, which strikes me as...a catastrophic misstep.
     
  12. BradfordBanter

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    @Dionysus@Dionysus A little off topic but just interested, every single post you've made has been in this thread, not a City fan?
     
  13. Nottsy

    Nottsy Squad Player

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    I must admit, I’m not sure how I’d vote if Labour’s plan came to fruition. Remaining in the European Union is obviously the sensible thing, but a remain win will definitely not be the end of it. I could vote for the deal, depending on what that deal is.
     
  14. Dionysus

    Dionysus Fringe Player

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    Aha, some with a good memory might remember me from the old C&B board. I took a bit of a break after that closed. I’m a city fan, but exiled down to London so I only manage to get to about a quarter of games.

    Use the City board for keeping up to date when I’m not there, but find the chat here to be much more representative of what people are actually thinking outside of London, and more rewarding debate.
     
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  15. Bronco

    Bronco Star Player
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    Ivan ?.
     
  16. Dionysus

    Dionysus Fringe Player

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    Aha, no not him! I’m using the same username.
     
  17. MallorcaBantam

    MallorcaBantam Impact Sub

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    The annoying thing is that parliament can’t make up its mind what to do
    The people of the UK can’t either
    But the people that voted for the MPs are paying them all a wage
    You have money to burn,
     
  18. Bronco

    Bronco Star Player
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    With the likes of Lib/Dems, Green, Change and Labour and some Tories all wanting to remain the vote had little chance of getting implemented.
     
  19. Hoochy-Min

    Hoochy-Min Squad Player

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    It's a sensible position but a losing one. The problem they have is that many of their absolute banker winning seats are in areas that voted to leave.

    I suspect the Tories will lose all of their Scotland MPs to the SNP but gain a few in traditional Labour areas with Farage's support. I can't see anybody taking the LibDems seriously at all.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
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  20. Offcomedun

    Offcomedun Important Player
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    Not sure about that.
    There are quite a few affluent southern seats that normally vote Tory which were strongly Remain in the referendum. I can see a number of those going Lib Dem. Also in the South West, which is a traditional Lib Dem stronghold, support for them is likely to bounce back.
     

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