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Discussion in 'City Talk' started by knaresborough bantam, Mar 25, 2021.

  1. Fordy117

    Fordy117 Just call me Mr Flip-Flop!
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    This I fully agree with. Just need Bradford City fans to start waking up to this.
     
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  2. hornseabantam

    hornseabantam Squad Player

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    Without ownership of our ground and the positive commercial equities that this could lead to, renting is wasted money for us. This for me is crucial to our future. We spend less on agents fees, sign ons and a lot of the players wages than we do every season on our rent for the ground. That's an immediate outlay. But long term, it drains money from the club that we can't invest in any way in our future. The day we own VP again, is the day we can start moving forward as a big proper professional club again.
     
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  3. 1975citygent

    1975citygent Impact Sub

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    Yes I want an owner who sees buying back the ground as a priority, not least as a statement of intent.
     
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  4. hornseabantam

    hornseabantam Squad Player

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    It is literally the hope for our future.
     
  5. city exile

    city exile Fringe Player

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    Re the idea of ground purchase, has anybody any info as to the possible cost (assuming Gibb was prepared tp sell). And how it would stack up against a new ground in a better location - and without drainage problems. Don't shoot me down, just interested in the costings.
     
  6. fredm

    fredm Emergency Backup
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    So who is responsible for negotiating the new lease in the coming years? Does anyone know who the actual person(s) will be undertaking this on behalf of the Pension Fund? What is their interest in sport? Could they be City supporters?
     
  7. trevor

    trevor Squad Player
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    Owning the lease on the ground is highly profitable earning the pension fund millions, Perhaps Rupp may be attracted to negotiate its purchase for his own pension fund, Just a thought as he likes an investment that brings a profit
     
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  8. andyc

    andyc Impact Sub
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    Fordy. I think most City fans are well aware, we do not own the stadium or training ground. Unfortunately the vast majority don't have a spare £10 million stuffed under the bed like you and can do nothing about it.
     
  9. Bigrod

    Bigrod Captain
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    The cost of renting Valley Parade was £370,000 a season in 2011 https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/football/bradford-city/exclusive-bradford-city-could-quit-valley-parade-over-rent-costs-1935317
    Apparently ‘the current rent for example is £434k per annum’. https://widthofapost.com/2020/10/14/assessing-the-finances-of-bradford-city/
    Rather than make up figures, this article covers most new stadium projects in England. https://footballgroundguide.com/about-the-author/developments.html Brentford £70 million, whereas Wimbledon £30 million (but it only holds 9,000).
    Or try this one https://www.purepropertyfinance.co.uk/news/stadium-property-prices-these-are-the-new-football-stadiums-currently-being-built/

    So even if land is cheaper in the north, the fact that Bradford is in the Pennine chain, has steep valleys and little spare land, would counterbalance savings, given increased engineering and construction costs.

    So take a round and very simple figure of £40 million for a 25,000 seater stadium.

    Renting Valley Parade at an increased sum of say £500,000 for 25 years would cost the club around £12.5 million. They would not have to borrow money (and pay interest on the sum).

    So not shooting you down, but just trying to give some loose form of context about the possibility.
     
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  10. Fordy117

    Fordy117 Just call me Mr Flip-Flop!
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    Not about having a spare 10m mate and Rupp does.
     
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  11. Pomfretbantam

    Pomfretbantam Fringe Player
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    I have a concern about any ground purchase (totally unfounded but there anyway). If Rupp bought the ground back from the pension fund would we be any better off?
    My concern is that Rupp would own the ground and can technically charge whatever rent he wants, he could then sell the club and keep hold of the ground (think Rotherham and Coventry in the past).
    I am not saying he would play the sort of dirty tricks that have happened at other clubs but the potential to do so is there. At least the pension fund are governed by strict rules which will help to prevent that sort if thing.
    If the ground is bought back it needs to belong to the football club and not a private individual.
     
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  12. andyc

    andyc Impact Sub
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    No its about you saying city fans are happy clapper's and need to wake up. You need to cheer up buddy.
    Also Rupp may be worth £100 million+, but how much of that is ready cash and how much assets, he is not a real football fan and was dragged into it by a charleton.
     
  13. Fordy117

    Fordy117 Just call me Mr Flip-Flop!
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    Excuses, excuses. Bottom line is the club needs to be looking to have assets.

    And we have 2 years to get this sorted which lucky unlike you the club will understand this.

    Rhodes held us back massively and if Rupp can't afford to take us forward then he needs to sell the club.
     
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  14. nicknameless

    nicknameless Impact Sub

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    To one of the queue of people with 10s of millions to invest in a league 2 club without any current assets?

    Do you not see the chicken and egg nature of your statement about a sale?

    Listening to Sparks it's clear that the onus is on making 'the business' (City) a viable and sustainable proposition, an aim which is no doubt defined by the owner's agenda, unless you believe he is a silent disinterested (financially) owner. Purchase of the ground is a business decision within that business model to make it sustainable, and perhaps therefore saleable (who knows what the ultimate aim is in the next few years).

    There aren't many willing to pour multi-millions into lower league teams.
     
  15. Stafford Bantam

    Stafford Bantam Captain
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    It is my understanding that when Jack Tordoff, acting on behalf of the Club, had discussions with Gordon Gibb a few years back, the 'asking' price was £5.5 million.
     
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  16. 13eta

    13eta Fringe Player
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    Just to throw the posh owners in. They recently bought back the ground from the local council even though a new ground is planned.
    It means they’ll save a big chunk of rent and can potentially sell on for development in the future.
    They do have a good working relationship with the council who previously owned and the council needed to make some money to cover losses so advantageous situation.
    However the fact VP would be useless after the agreement ends if City move on should help some leverage in a buy back offer
     
  17. Bigrod

    Bigrod Captain
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    Just looking at this information, ‘How much interest on 5 million pounds? At a rate of 2.5%, 5 million pounds would earn £126,442 in interest in a year. A 5% interest rate would earn £255,809 in a year. Current Bank of England base rate interest is 0.1% and would earn just over £5,000 in one year.24 Jun 2020’.

    If the Pension Fund is making ‘£434,000’ a year, then it is a far better return than most investment which pays interest. If I was the Pension Fund, then I would be wanting around £10 million.

    If the Pension Fund bought the ground for £2.5 million in 2003,
    https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/football/bradford-city/exclusive-bradford-city-could-quit-valley-parade-over-rent-costs-1935317. Then the current difference given inflation is:-
    upload_2021-4-4_13-33-55.png
     
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  18. Fordy117

    Fordy117 Just call me Mr Flip-Flop!
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    Bloody hell I don't care about those willing to pour multi millions but I am convinced a welsh club is now owned by Hollywood stars. Anyway. Its up to Rupp, Sparks to be talking with the council, other organisations to see if they want in on the funding.

    Most football clubs are not viable. You don't enter owning a football club to make money but we need assets and if Gibbs want to sell then we need to be looking to buy but if not I am not convinced a 20 plus year lease on a stadium thats going to to cost a lot of money in maintenance is the way forward. VP is a mess, the pitch is a joke and 20 plus years it will be so run down that me we need to looking for an alternative.
     
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  19. Melbourne Bantam

    Melbourne Bantam Fringe Player
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    Not mentioned or talked about for a while but have we any new solid interest in a new owner or investment.

    Always found it weird Tordoff with his millions has never made a solid one off or some kind of financial support to a club he obviously cares about
     
  20. Fordy117

    Fordy117 Just call me Mr Flip-Flop!
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    Normally you don't hear about takeovers or investment until its done.

    I'll be shocked if Rupp isn't discussing one or the other.
     
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