Referees

Thats what batters your head in within the first 10 minues he can put a stop to it but sadly some of thes winkers crave the attention ...........the goalkeepera taking a age simply one warning followed by a booking its stops then but no we have attention seeking winkers giving out pointless warning ....... .............

 

Players get dragged to the ground and thrown about can’t believe we have almost gone a season without conceding a penalty

 

Give a foul or a penalty for any offence in the box . It’s only in the last three or four seasons where wrestling has been allowed because it makes officials life easier . We both know that instead of penalising either party it’s now accepted . On the field if playing grappling a player to the ground is 9/10 a foul, in the box it isn’t . Why ?

 

In the box I think refs let the grappling go 'til the ball is in the air from the corner.

 

The incidences in the box are much harder to officiate because you're looking at a crowded area with bodies everywhere obstructing your view and all players pushing and grappling with each other. You can't just randomly point at one person and say foul unless it's absolutely blatant. You make it sound so simple but you're not being realistic. I also suspect that we could sit down together and review every single set piece this season in our matches and you'd award 78 penalties to us and 0 to the opposition.

 

Watch a PL2 or u18 game and you'll see refs enforcing the 8 second rule (usually 10) and corners given, throw ins are also much faster. The keeper going down stuff still goes on though

 

I don’t think there was anything wrong with his officiating of individual incidents when the ball was in play. He tried to let the game flow and wasn’t overly fussy for either side.
My beef is that when one team blatantly and premeditatedly sets out from the outset to slow the game to a crawl by dragging out every stoppage to the nth degree then the ref has a responsibility, both to the other team and to the paying spectators, to nip it in the bud early.
It’s common knowledge that we want to play a fast paced game and that Stevenage are notorious for slowing it down as far as possible. That’s fair enough if they’re doing it by just keeping possession of the ball to frustrate us, but not if they are persistently breaking up the game by niggly fouls and extended breaks for throw ins, goal kicks etc. He should have warned their captain about the time wasting early and shown a yellow for the next instance. I don’t see why that’s so difficult or in any way unfair.

 

Ahhh, let's go to that veritable font of footballing knowledge again for confirmation....the Sunderland forum!!

You talk of having a proper debate but constantly want to criticise posters on here:

#5
"...but let's he honest if that'd been Walker carrying on like that and he'd have got booked we'd be crying blue murder on here..."

#31
"Im happy to have a proper debate about the refs but if you think Wright's challenge on the goalkeeper wasn't a foul then there's really no point. You won't admit it obviously but if that challenge is on Walker you'd be saying its a foul all day long. Nobody away from this board would support your view."

#45
"I also suspect that we could sit down together and review every single set piece this season in our matches and you'd award 78 penalties to us and 0 to the opposition."

In a number of your posts you seem to indicate that referees turn a 'blind eye' to time wasting:

#8
"...I think refs are reluctant to book for time wasting as they know they'll get accused of being inconsistent so they tend to just leave it alone."

#28
"...1. Refs allow time wasting across the board (at least they're consistent)."

And in one post (#33) you openly admit "...The first one the ref bottled it. He didn't want a goal being conceded from a mistake from him and he went for the safe option."

You also seem to confirm that officials turn a blind eye to grappling in the box...

#38
"...It's part of the reason why officials have just ignored it unless it's absolutely blatant."

So basically, in essence, you have confirmed in your opinion that referees regularly ignore some of the laws of the game for their convenience and that they knowingly make incorrect decisions to cover up their mistakes. Then you wonder why they are criticised....

That doesn't appear to be right (fundamentally wrong in my opinion) or in the spirit of the game as indicated by IFAB...."...The IFAB expects the referee to make a decision within the ‘spirit’ of the game and the Laws – this often involves asking the question, ‘what would football want/expect?’"



On Saturday, they knew it was happening but took no action to stop it, not in the spirit of the game surely.

As I said in the Stevenage thread, the referee spoke to the goalkeeper about it, then about 5 minutes later he spoke to the captain Piergianni about it, he waved at the goalkeeper several times to take the goal kick and at one point after a celebration he told the goalkeeper to get on with it and pointed at the ball. The 4th official also knew it was happening, GA said so in his post match interview. These incidents were witnessed with my own eyes and as stated by GA.

You mention that we would complain if Walker was booked doing the same thing.....that is irrelevant to the specific discussion around the Stevenage goalkeeper time wasting and the lack of action from the weak match officials. The match officials knew it was happening but chose to do nothing about it.....

IFAB:
Delaying the restart of play Referees must caution players who delay the restart of play by:
• appearing to take a throw-in but suddenly leaving it to a team-mate to take
• delaying leaving the field of play when being substituted
• excessively delaying a restart
• kicking or carrying the ball away, or provoking a confrontation by deliberately touching the ball after the referee has stopped play
• taking a free kick from the wrong position to force a retake



It was excessive because the referee spoke to him, spoke to the captain and waved him into action numerous times but he continued to take an inordinate amount of time without any punishment.

By turning a blind eye they are condoning it and exacerbating the situation for those that have paid good money to watch a football game not a goalkeeper arrange his shin pads, clean his studs, bounce the ball, fall to his knees, go from one side of the box to the other......

 

I am not a referee but I could see exactly what the keeper was doing at each dead ball lick. Why couldn't the referee or the lino(s).

I like to think I am reasonably fair in my analysis of referees but that free kick he gave for the keeper smashing into two players , dropping the ball and falling on his head was a complete joke. That was a foul anywhere else on the pitch if any one of our players smashed through the back of one of theirs

 

Jesus you've got a massive problem with me haven't you pal. I think 'criticising posters' is a bit much. I'm disagreeing with them. I'm sure Kev isn't too upset that I'm accusing him of being slightly rose tinted in his view of incidents involving City. It's really not that deep. You're the only one who seems to get so riled up about my defence of referees and there's a fair few posters that see where I'm coming from.

 

This shirt pulling thing. I don't think it needs a context like promising attack or whatever. It's an off the ball foul, seeking to gain an advantage or denying your opponent an advantage. It should be penalised. The more you leave laws open to interpretation the more complex you make the ref's job. Just fcking blow for a foul

 

I’m being perfectly realistic… It’s only being permitted in the last few seasons. Why?

 

This article is the best one that covers that question.

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/13515060/why-has-premier-league-seen-influx-of-holding-and-grappling-at-set-pieces-can-anything-be-done-to-stop-it

In short, the feedback from managers and captains within the game was that they want a 'high bar' for penalising handballs and grappling in the box allowing a certain amount of physical contact. I agree it's gone too far but the line is very hard to draw. When does acceptable use of the arms become an offense? It's a very hard line to draw.

You could take about 20 high profile incidents from the PL this season where a player has allegedly committed an offence and you'll get a 50/50 split on whether or not it should be a pen. It's what journalists and pundits spend most of their time debating so it's not black and white.

 

Call me old fashioned but it is black and white . A foul is a foul irrespective of where it takes place on the field of play. We cannot have different rules for different areas of the field. Call it a draw here but I am old school , no question.

 

If it's black and white then there'd never be any disagreements on whether or not someone has committed a foul. Everyone would just agree and there'd be complete unanymity on whether or not a foul has been committed. I don't know how we ever get to that point. There is no way that anyone can claim the laws of the game are objective (apart from goal line). Take any live game and it's guaranteed that you can have at least one incident that splits opinion. Man Utd v Leeds last night for example. Look at Calvert Lewin's challenge on Yoro for the first goal, loads of debate online about whether that's a foul, loads of debate about whether Martinez should've been sent off. Incidents are debated endlessly.

I agree that the 'holding' in the box has gone too far but stick 20 people in a room and you'll get 20 different opinions on what constitutes 'legal' physical contact and what constitutes a foul.

 

You're right, but what I would say to a ref is don't blow for a foul in the centre circle or elsewhere on the pitch if you wouldn't give it in the penalty area, or vice versa......

 

Whether we like it or not there is a different set of rules in the box. Favouring defenders

 

I agree that it can be difficult to decide what is holding and what isn't, but it couldn't be any clearer when a player has a hold of a bunch of the opposing players shirt. Free kick or penalty - simple as.

 

Where does it say that in the rule book?

 

Doesn’t say it anywhere it’s just a fact